D&D (2024) "Sword" and Board Build?

[UngeheuerLich]

I'm not seeing any AoE spells in their repertoire... so unless you always have a conveniently placed one-square doorframe around, if you are a 300hp tank with AC25+, and facing non-zombie enemies, they can just go past you at someone squishier.

Not with a bit of feat support...

Grapple or trip as opportunity attack also helps.

 

[ECMO3]

I have simple houserule feat for S&B style, that gives you extra damage and it's a no brainer.

Shield basher.
requires proficiency with shields
+1 STR or CON

As a Bonus action you can make one melee attack with your shield.
attack deals 1d6 damage,
you add STR to attack roll and damage
you can apply Sap, Push, Topple or Graze mastery to attack.
any +X bonus to AC from shield applies to attack and damage bonus.

This is way OP. This will outdamage other build styles in addition to giving essentially three free masteries and the best AC possible.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

I'm not seeing any AoE spells in their repertoire... so unless you always have a conveniently placed one-square doorframe around, if you are a 300hp tank with AC25+, and facing non-zombie enemies, they can just go past you at someone squishier.

Aside from subclass abilities, the extra feats fighters get aid with battlefield control.

 

[Horwath]

This is way OP. This will outdamage other build styles in addition to giving essentially three free masteries and the best AC possible.

it's comparable to PAM build(without using GWM) in terms of damage.
now the choice is getting reaction attack and extra reach vs. +2 AC

using GWM still out damages this.

 

[Willie the Duck]

Problem is it feels line you're being punished for not using dual wielder or GWM.

One way to look at it is that you are punished for not using 2H or 2WF strategies... provided you do not count the opportunity cost of investing in those fighting strategies. They each outperform S&B in damage -- provided you go all in on those strategies, taking the feats and fighting styles and masteries and such to facilitate them. If, instead, you just took the weapon masteries (or also fighting style, but then dueling for S&B), well then the damage disparity is significantly less. Meanwhile, since you aren't taking Dual Wielding or GWM and PAM, the paladin gets to pick up war caster and resilient:con -- and a S&B paladin with Radiant Smite that doesn't lose it every-other round is another avenue towards dealing a lot of damage. The fighter gets to get resilient:wis or mage slayer and maybe a group support feat -- and those are also avenues towards overall party success. And so on.

 

[fluffybunbunkittens]

Not with a bit of feat support...
Grapple or trip as opportunity attack also helps.

Aside from subclass abilities, the extra feats fighters get aid with battlefield control.

Fighter still has just the one opportunity attack. No feats (or subclasses!) let you get more. It's basically meaningless when there's still a dozen other gribblies.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

Fighter still has just the one opportunity attack. No feats help with that. It's basically meaningless when there's still a dozen other gribblies.

Yeah. Let that be the other character's worries.

Probably the ranger who is good at AOE can deal with them.

Or be an eldritch knight with a few area spells.

Not everyone has to be good at everything.
Fighter locks down one tough creature.

 

[ECMO3]

it's comparable to PAM build(without using GWM) in terms of damage.

Assuming optimal fighting style it is more damage than a PAM build. It is comparable to PAM+GWM, while having a better AC and getting 3 more weapon masteries on a single feat.

You are doing 1d6 with your bonus action attack instead of 1d4 with PAM and doing more damage with your attacks on your attack action as well (6.5 with longsword/axe/hammer/trident/rapier etc vs 5.8 with Glaive/Halberd).

using GWM still out damages this.

No it won't, it is less at low level and about the same through level 8 without weapon masteries. When you consider masteries it will be behind at every level below 9 on a Fighter, every level except 9-10 on a Paladin and it would barely be ahead there. It would also be lower across the board on a Ranger.

Using GWM and GWF at 4th level with an 18 strength and a Maul is 14DPR (4 strength, 8 Maul, 2 GWM). Using this homebrew feat a Rapier and dueling it is 18 DPR (3.5 Shield, 6.5 Rapier, 8 strength).

At 5th level it is 30 GWM and 28.5 with this feat, but that is before you consider the effect of the mastery properties or critical hits, both of which are going to favor the shield guy if you are optimizing for damage with a Rapier.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Yeah. Let that be the other character's worries.

Probably the ranger who is good at AOE can deal with them.

Or be an eldritch knight with a few area spells.

Not everyone has to be good at everything.
Fighter locks down one tough creature.

You can cover large groups with subclass abilities (this is why people are suggesting EK). Fear is good, as is Enlarge. Goliaths can also do the later of course.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Fighter still has just the one opportunity attack. No feats (or subclasses!) let you get more. It's basically meaningless when there's still a dozen other gribblies.

If the first gibbly to try to do an end run around the fighter knows he will die by opportunity attack, then if the gribblies have any sense of self preservation none of them are going to try the end run.

And if you have Shield Master and Sentinel, you can knock a gribbly back and down on your turn, so they don’t have enough move left to run past, and still have your reaction to stop another.