D&D General The 2024 PHB is the best Player's Handbook ever

[THEMNGMNT]

Frankly, I'm still with the 13th Age Core Book. And it had to also have all the DMG and MM stuff in it.

It had the Rules Glossary before 2014 5e was originally released It was fantastic. That's now 11 year old idea, having it at this point is just keeping up with the Joneses.

It had different information about the classes, like a complexity guide for players.

But most of all it had sidebars from the two designers explaining why the rules were what they were, and consequences of changing them. They even had cases why where they differed and why they ended up with this rule. It made hacking and adjusting the game so much easier, and without that designer dive into the why of the rules, it's very hard for any other rulebook to compete.

Oh yeah, and art, layout, etc.

Not putting down the 2024 PHB, but it's missing some things to be considered "a masterpiece", and other things were praiseworthy when they came out before 5e, but are just "not falling behind" 11 years later.

EDIT: 13th Age was a d20 OGL, made by a lead designer of 3ed, Jonathan Tweet, and the lead designer of 4e, Rob Heinsoo, as the game they would want to play in their weekly game, and as a "love letter to D&D". It also adopted a streamlined approach, much like 5e followed with, though was able to break with certain sacred cows since it wasn't "D&D" as a brand.

I'm 20 sessions into my campaign for Eyes of the Stone Thief. 13th Age is an excellent system. I've been raiding it for ideas for years, and I'm glad to be finally playing it outright. But I find the layout and art of the book to be much lower quality than any recent version of D&D -- likely due to budget.

 

[Theory of Games]

I'm not claiming the 2024 rules are the best version of Dungeon & Dragons ever. Although I believe they probably are, it's a matter of personal taste. Reasonable people can disagree.

So. You aren't trying to make a point. This thread is just for the lolz?

But there is no doubt the 2024 PHB is the best Player's Handbook ever published.

Introducing the game: The examples of play in Chapter 1 are the best intro to D&D since the old Red Box.

Nearly every version has examples of play. How is one example better than another, version to version?

The rules glossary: All the rules, all in one place. It's not a dream! It's real!

Believe it or not, previous editions had a table of contents and index for ease of rules reference.

Characters: Presentation of classes, subclasses, species, and backgrounds is clear and inspiring.

How is it better (as you say) than previous editions?

Stuff: There's just a lot here. Gobs of subclasses, feats, gear, spells, etc. I haven't counted the numbers, but this must be the most comprehensive, complete, and authoritative PHB of any edition.

"Stuff" ..... yeah. How is "stuff" more comprehensive and authoritative than previous editions?

The design: The book is beautiful and presents information in a way that's easy to understand.

Go hang out on D&D Beyond's Discord channel and tell me that again (it's a stream of constant typos and errors found by players).

The art: While not always to my personal taste, both the quality and quantity of art are unmatched.

More evocative of all the fantasy genres than earlier editions? Nope. The lastest art will never touch Erol Otus, Dave Trampier, Jeff Dee and Larry Elmore.

In order, my favorite PHBs are: 2024 5E, 3E, and 4E. 1E, 2E, and 2014 5E have many great qualities, but they're not my personal faves.

TL;DR the 2024 Player's Handbook is a masterpiece.

If 2024 is a masterpiece, then the D&D Rules Cyclopedia should be worshiped as holy writ, because it's the benchmark of what D&D is meant to be. WotC has never made the commitment to high-level play that is offered in the RC. No rules for land-owning PCs. No rules for building powerful alliances. No rules for establishing strongholds and kingdoms. No rules for waging war against monster hordes or rival nations.

In order to be the best, the game has to offer the best options. WotC never has.

 

[THEMNGMNT]

So. You aren't trying to make a point. This thread is just for the lolz?

Nearly every version has examples of play. How is one example better than another, version to version?

Believe it or not, previous editions had a table of contents and index for ease of rules reference.

How is it better (as you say) than previous editions?

"Stuff" ..... yeah. How is "stuff" more comprehensive and authoritative than previous editions?

Go hang out on D&D Beyond's Discord channel and tell me that again (it's a stream of constant typos and errors found by players).

More evocative of all the fantasy genres than earlier editions? Nope. The lastest art will never touch Erol Otus, Dave Trampier, Jeff Dee and Larry Elmore.

If 2024 is a masterpiece, then the D&D Rules Cyclopedia should be worshiped as holy writ, because it's the benchmark of what D&D is meant to be. WotC has never made the commitment to high-level play that is offered in the RC. No rules for land-owning PCs. No rules for building powerful alliances. No rules for establishing strongholds and kingdoms. No rules for waging war against monster hordes or rival nations.

In order to be the best, the game has to offer the best options. WotC never has.

I don't believe you're engaging with my post in good faith.

 

[Theory of Games]

I don't believe you're engaging with my post in good faith.

I don't think you know what "best" means

 

[Mistwell]

Every chance I get. It was and is a great read.

I am torn on this topic but I see where you're coming from. The 1e DMG for instance is a real tome of wonder. Even to this day, so many decades later, I find new things every time I pick it up and turn to a random page. There is an allure to that experience which is beyond mechanical rules. Definitely when I was young, it was an important part of my enjoyment of the game.

On the other hand, as I get older and have a family and job and social life and so many things that demand my time (and make me tired) I just don't find I have the energy or time to deal with that as much. I tend to prefer a more organized set of rules, where I can find what I am looking for quickly, and it's explained in plainer language that I don't need to wrap my head around it every time.

But I am not the demographic for these new rules. Is the newer generation missing out on what I found so fascinating when I was the younger generation? My daughter is just starting to be interested in the game, and my nephew already is deep into it. I do wonder if they will be missing out on something magical at the expense of utility.

 

[Mistwell]

I haven't seen it but it sounds stupid tbh.

The arts different in book though vs seeing it online. Probably won't see the book for 2-3 weeks. Yay.

I was going to offer to pick up a copy here in the States and mail it to you through work, but sounds like you found a solution there. Glad to hear that. Looking forward to reading your review.

 

[Zardnaar]

I was going to offer to pick up a copy here in the States and mail it to you through work, but sounds like you found a solution there. Glad to hear that. Looking forward to reading your review.

Cheers mate even if you did tgat by the time it got here I woud probably be able to get it.

I'm not going to run it any time soon though so it's not that urgent.

I have sourced RPG via friends in America in effect swapping it for NZ sports wear.

Guy I was trading it to had a wear whatever you like to work once a week or whatever. His friends wore foot ball Jerseys he rocked up in an All Black top, Canterbury Crusaders or whatever. Then his wife wanted the female ones.

He also worked on the old Star Wars line in effect he gifted me his personal collection basically for free ($71 ebay auction $73 postage). He didn't charge me for postage.

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[EyeOfHorus]

The material components of spells are now specified whether or not they are consumed.
Which saves so many arguments imo

 

[Enrico Poli1]

Lol it isn't!
It's a huge step back from the 2014.
(Plus, the AD&D1e, D&D3.0 and 3.5 were better)

• The illustrations and atmosphere are overall cringe
• Tries to remove unbalanced features, adds a ton more
• More complex (5e sold so much also because of simplicity)
• Unnaturally schematic (every class has 4 subclasses. Why?)

It is C tier, B at most

 

[FrozenNorth]

I never found it goofy, and certainly not awkward and pathetic, and would never use those terms to describe something in a discussion, because it is insulting and inflammatory.

Pot, meet kettle.

I would think the rules themselves would be a (major) relevant factor regarding whether or not a PH can be called, "the greatest ever". Yet people keep getting hung up on the pretty wrapping paper and gift box.