D&D 4E The 4E Rogue...love it or hate it?

[CleverNickName]

I prefer binary polls. Selecting 'Other' is deeply, deeply lame so anything that thwarts it is a good move.

This.

 

[CleverNickName]

*Shrugs* it was about a quarter when I made the post, as count goes up the results are changing. Probably should have waited longer.

Averaging various EN World 4e polls together it looks like a group somewhere between .2 and .33 has problems with the new addition. As always no telling how well any of it can be applied at a larger scale.

But it does create the question where are the new players coming from? Even if the issue of splitting the customer base is ignored one of the design goals of 4e is apparently to draw in new players. But I have no idea how they're going to get them. D&D is very much a niche hobby with little mainstream penetration into the population. Most everybody who plays now either started a long time ago or was brought in by someone else who does. The game spreads by word-of-mouth and direct interpersonal ties. To bring in an influx as the designers hope requires something more. So where are the ads, the magazine promos, commercials, internet ads? How do they intend to target the 10-year olds of today without any means advertizing the game to them?

Ya know, I probably should have known better...but I really did not intend for this poll to be interpreted as a veiled assessment of the 4E game itself. Really, I was just interested in what everyone thought of the rogue. Not 4E, just the 4E rogue.

I am sure that there are some people out there who really like 4E but didn't necessarily like the way the rogue was being portrayed. And conversely, I am sure that there are some people out there who really hate 4E but liked the new rogue on some level. I'm sure they are in the minority, sure, but they have to be out there nonetheless.

Some people hate All Things 4E, and that's cool. Some people automatically love All Things 4E, and that's cool too. But it's not really cool when we lose the ability to be objective about it. Objectively speaking, I like the rogue. That doesn't automatically make me pro-4E (I'm reserving judgement until I see the magic system, personally).

 

[ThirdWizard]

That's why I say silly. It is genuinely silly to only provide binary options when you're going to use the words "Love" and "Hate" in those binary options. Realistically, very few of us feel that strongly, I would suspect. It really does tell us LESS than a poll with more options.

The poll itself actually says "like" and "not like."

Of course, one of my pet peeves is polls that differ in the topic name and poll question.

 

[Ruin Explorer]

The poll itself actually says "like" and "not like."

Of course, one of my pet peeves is polls that differ in the topic name and poll question.

Oh yeah. Huh. I hate that too. I always end up answering the topic question in such polls, unless they're so wildly different that it's immediately obvious.

 

[Thornir Alekeg]

Role: Doesn't mention anything outside of combat. Surely it should be titled "combat role", then? The whole text seems hyper-focused on combat, which is kinda lame.

This so far has probably been my biggest concern with 4e. I realize that the bulk of the crunch is in the combat side of things, so that is where preview information will likely continue to focus, but there can be so much more to PCs than just combat. I usually played a Rogue less for the combat aspects than for the stealth and skills.

The emphasis of combat in the Role description combined with the abilites that move players about on the battlemat keep giving me the feeling that they are trying to solidify D&D as a tactical combat game with a side of roleplaying.

I know that is how many play the game. I do it myself sometimes, but I hope there is more in the final PHB about the stuff beyond combat.

 

[SteveC]

I prefer binary polls. Selecting 'Other' is deeply, deeply lame so anything that thwarts it is a good move.

I have to agree here: if you include the "well, I like some things, but not others," option, that's all you get, and then your poll means nothing. Yes, there are good and bad parts to any aspect of D&D, we get that...do you like it or not, on balance?

--Steve

 

[Ruin Explorer]

This so far has probably been my biggest concern with 4e. I realize that the bulk of the crunch is in the combat side of things, so that is where preview information will likely continue to focus, but there can be so much more to PCs than just combat. I usually played a Rogue less for the combat aspects than for the stealth and skills.

The emphasis of combat in the Role description combined with the abilites that move players about on the battlemat keep giving me the feeling that they are trying to solidify D&D as a tactical combat game with a side of roleplaying.

I know that is how many play the game. I do it myself sometimes, but I hope there is more in the final PHB about the stuff beyond combat.

Yeah, and people keep telling me that I'm worrying about nothing, that y'know, Exalted's charms are mostly focused on combat too, and that's not one long battlemat melee with no RP, and honestly, I hope they're right, but when you define a character's entire "role", a character traditionally associated with sneaking, disarming traps, picking locks, picking pockets, tricking people and stealing stuff (optionally), and you don't mention one thing out of combat? It's pretty darn worrying.

 

[Klaus]

I prefer binary polls. Selecting 'Other' is deeply, deeply lame so anything that thwarts it is a good move.

You are entitled to preferring binary polls.

Just realize that the smaller the brush you use, the more accurate the painting you get.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

even if you like roleplaying, sitting dumb in the corner, hoping not to die while others have fun is, you know, not funny at all...

... but of course we have yet to see the ingenious OOC mechanics, skills and feats, which make roleplaying fun. But I think every rule not preventing roleplaying is a good rule. And seriously, i can´t remember any 3.5 rule supporting roleplaying...maybe some spells you never chose... and i trust the designers when they say: combat and roleplaying are not mutually exclusive anymore! (attack and utility options)

 

[Ruin Explorer]

even if you like roleplaying, sitting dumb in the corner, hoping not to die while others have fun is, you know, not funny at all...

Was there a class that had to do that in 3.5E? Because that sure wasn't how the Rogue acted in any 3E or 3.5E game I've ever witnessed or even read about.