D&D 5E The core issue of the martial/caster gap is just the fundamental design of d20 fantasy casters.

What options could a non-magical character possibly have that compare with that thought? Make your martials supernatural at a certain point, however, and you're golden.

Important to remember that the classes don't have to be balanced through equality; they can be balanced through equity instead. Ie, you don't need abilities to be of comparable capability as long as they are comparable worth, and theres plenty one can do to fulfill that.

Course, my own opinion is that trying to balance classes against each other is a waste of time and energy that ultimately just results in clawing back what certain characters should be capable of.

The game can be balanced in other ways that open up class design to no longer be so conservative.
 

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ECMO3

Hero
Ohhh, goodie. I get a total of ONE choice after character generation.

No that is not true. You asked about what choice you got at 12th level specifically, when you turn 12th level.

Since character generation you got a minimum of 13 choices through 12th level. That 13 includes only things from your class chassis, it does not include anything from race or background. Additionally depending on time and gold available you have additional choices in terms of the false identities you can create as part of your subclass.
 
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Hussar

Legend
No that is not true. You asked about what choice you got at 12th level specifically, when you turn 12th level.

Since character generation you got a minimum of 13 choices through 12th level. That 13 includes only things from your class chassis, it does not include anything from race or background. Additionally depending on time and gold available you have additional choices in terms of the false identities you can create as part of your subclass.

What 13 choices? Race or background only give choices at charges.
 


Hussar

Legend
Whether to MC is a choice you make every time you level?
Yeah, I'm kinda baffled frankly. What choices does a rogue get at each level up, besides level 3 where you choose a subclass?

Maybe this is an idiosyncratic definition of "choice". Would not be the first time I've been tripped up by something like that.
 

Clint_L

Hero
Obviously spellcasters get to make more choices when they level, some more than others. Whether that is a flaw or a feature depends on the player. Whether the choices are optimal or suboptimal depends partially on the player’s meta knowledge of the game (ie most new players don’t realize that healing word is significantly better than cure wounds) and mostly upon the DM’s choices.
 

doctorbadwolf

Heretic of The Seventh Circle
3. If a book publishes new spells, it must publish at least as many new options, features, etc. that don't involve or even interact with spellcasting
This seems like a strange requirement. This won’t keep the game balanced. It will just ensure that some number of non Spellcasting features are forced half-assed garbage made to fill an arbitrary quota.

Did you know that 5e has printed almost three times as many new spells (159) as it has new feats (62)? And that there were almost nine times as many spells as feats in the PHB (361 spells, 42 feats)?
Yes? So what?

The two categories of rules objects…serve different purposes. Like there are more magic items than vehicles, too. 🤷
 

Hussar

Legend
Obviously spellcasters get to make more choices when they level, some more than others. Whether that is a flaw or a feature depends on the player. Whether the choices are optimal or suboptimal depends partially on the player’s meta knowledge of the game (ie most new players don’t realize that healing word is significantly better than cure wounds) and mostly upon the DM’s choices.
But, we're not even talking about optimization or anything like that. That's so subjective anyway - what's optimized in one game might not be in another. That's not the point.

It's the "obviously" part that's the problem. Why should it be "obvious"? Why shouldn't non-casters get to make just as many choices as casters when they level up? Other than tradition, of course. And, it's not like it's even close. If you're playing a non-caster, the only choices your class gives you is at 3rd level when you pick your sub-class. Maybe a feat or two? That's about it. IOW, the non-casters get less choices over their entire career than casters get by level 3.
 

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