D&D General The Transition of a D&D World into the Industrial Era

[Beleriphon]

What about the agent trying to get to the instigators of the revolt?

If we're comparing them to large scale revolutions like the French Revolution then the actual revolt pulled in members of the army, and had went through several leaders. It also wasn't anywhere near as centralized as the Reign of Terror in Paris makes it out to be, realistically the ability of Paris to control the rest of France was extremely limited and many areas just did their own thing after getting rid of the local aristocracy, or having the locals aristocracy side with the revolutionaries.

Large scale revolutions that are largely internal to a nation tend to take on a life of their own and can't be stopped by killing a few people. The original leadership structure needs to quell it by giving people what they want, demonstrating its not longer necessary to revolt (force can do this, but only if they can effecitvely project force without abandoning another area), or dying.

There were other revolts in the mid to late 19th century, but they tended to be much smaller scale. The Russian Revolution is an abnormality but not unexpected. It wouldn't have worked if the Czar hadn't been such a putz and assumed everybody loved him (spoiler alert: they didn't), and if the army hadn't sided with Bolsheviks. Even then the Russian Revolution turned into the Russian Civil War for another four years with the White and the Red Russians fighting each other. By the end the Reds had managed to get peasants on their side with a bunch of promises of land reforms and promises of food while the Whites basically said, "Commies suck, we're going to go back to the way it was."

What skills can do is tightly constrained by bounded accuracy and realism.

Or rather the way the rules let adventurers interface with the imagined world are constrained. I wouldn't assume the average peasant is going to use numbers or values similar to the way the skill system operates in general.

Anyways, I don't think firearms or magic actually make large scale revolutions any different in the long run since they tend to operate on psychology and promises rather than actual physical violence be successful. Violence is inevitable but its never ultimately what makes them successful. If there is magic on one side, eventually magic will end up on the other its the nature of the beast.

 

[generic]

The success of a revolutionary force is usually measured by the unity of ideals. A revolutionary group of rabble may yet overthrow the king through the correct application of fanaticism.

Without a certain level of devotion, the peasants will retreat, and mourn their dead, content to live under a despot as long as they are allowed to live at all.

I wonder what role religion could play. A group of revolutionaries aided by a cult with the power to churn out Warlocks may yet have a chance against a powerful, and magically-aided government.

 

[Tony Vargas]

Or rather the way the rules let adventurers interface with the imagined world are constrained. (by BA & realism) I wouldn't assume the average peasant is going to use numbers or values similar to the way the skill system operates in general.

Oh? So it'd be, what, harder for an invisible assassin to sneak by an ordinary peasant than a PC trained in perception?

Anyways, I don't think firearms or magic actually make large scale revolutions any different in the long run since they tend to operate on psychology and promises rather than actual physical violence be successful. Violence is inevitable but its never ultimately what makes them successful. If there is magic on one side, eventually magic will end up on the other its the nature of the beast.

That is sensible. Oh, magic will be on either side, it'll roughly cancel out, was a rationale for D&D societies & architecture staying roughly medieval going way back. But it's not very interesting.

 

[generic]

A new topic:

"What spells or magical abilities, be specific, would affect an IR and/or a Revolution?"

 

[Beleriphon]

Oh? So it'd be, what, harder for an invisible assassin to sneak by an ordinary peasant than a PC trained in perception?

Not my intention to suggest that at all; I'm more suggesting that the peasants don't, and probably wont, get proficiency in most stuff. NPC values are largely arbitrary anyways, so peasants are as competent or not so as to be challenging, or not (I lean heavily towards the not competent side), as necessary. That doesn't have much to do with the PC process for determining proficiency or values of skills and what not.

That is sensible. Oh, magic will be on either side, it'll roughly cancel out, was a rationale for D&D societies & architecture staying roughly medieval going way back. But it's not very interesting.

No, its not super interesting. As a thought though weight of numbers counts for something though. The Chinese Revolution was heavily tilted by weight of numbers, Mao always felt it was the Chinese advantage: they have more people than anybody else. He leveraged the peasant population to tremendous advantage after WWII despite being the Communists being at a significant technological disadvantage to the Nationalists.

 

[Beleriphon]

A new topic:

"What spells or magical abilities, be specific, would affect an IR and/or a Revolution?"

I'm going to assume wizard spell list so start. I'm also only going to focus on the industry stuff, since any spell useful to an adventurer is useful in a revolution.

Cantrips
Mage Hand - usable at will and lets a spell caster with access move small things safely
Message - who needs telegraph, Amiright?
Prestidigitation - all kinds of neat stuff, like instant cleaning

1st Level
Comprehend Languages - why learn another language when you can magic?
Feather Fall - safety first!
Floating Disk - carry heavy loads
Unseen Servant - servants best not seen or heard, just like children.

2nd Level
Continual Flame - did you know the Heinz factory was the first factory lit entirely by electric lamps? Safe, and efficient
Gentle Repose - for those times Feather Fall doesn't work
Levitate - no more ladders!
Shatter - might work in mining and clearing land

3rd Level
Protection from Energy - lets factory works wander through furnances unimpeded! Outstanding!
Sending - see Message
Tongues - speak anything language in addition to reading and hearing!
Water Breathing - no more cumbersome diving bells!

4th Level
Conjure Minor Elementals - fire elements can help make steel
Control Water - lets make waterwheels extra efficient
Fabricate - rapidly turn raw products into finished goods
Stone Shape - change the landscape to suit your needs, handy in a coal mine

5th Level
Conure Elemental
Telekinese - see Mage Hand but more
Teleportation Circle - this is the big one its functionally Star Trek if you know the sigil sequence
Wall of Stone - quick building material

6th Level
Disintegrate - why tunnel your way through a mountain when you can disintegrate your way through?

7th Level
Reverse Gravity - lift anything in a given area
Teleport - like Teleport Circle but works from anywhere

8th Level
Demiplane - its a warehouse that take up no physical space

9th Level
Gate - get some friendly (or not so friendly) help from anywhere in the planes
Wish - because Wish

 

[Tony Vargas]

I wonder what role religion could play. A group of revolutionaries aided by a cult with the power to churn out Warlocks may yet have a chance against a powerful, and magically-aided government.

Religion has had a tremendous impact in history, sans supernatural powers of any kind. You have to imagine that influence would be magnified with such powers both on it's own side, and to oppose.

 

[generic]

Religion has had a tremendous impact in history, sans supernatural powers of any kind. You have to imagine that influence would be magnified with such powers both on it's own side, and to oppose.

In my setting, it might actually tip in the favor of the Revolutionaries, given that the gods are not definitely known to exist. Of course, the powers of Paladins and Clerics are still rather potent, god or no visible god.

The strength of faith is strong, regardless.

 

[Kobold Avenger]

On the idea of Voodoo having an integral part in the Haitian Revolution, Voodoo itself is a hybrid religion that combines Yoruban and Catholic traditions.

If there are a people that have been exploited and enslaved, they might come up with a new religion that combines their indigenous religion with the religion of their oppressors.

 

[Fenris-77]

Security concerns for both sides would be enormously influenced by simple spells like disguise and alter self, plus all the manifold telepathy type spells and the mess of infiltration stuff like invisibility etc. Information and operational security would be whole different thing, a fact that D&D usually doesn't address. Cryptography is essentially useless, so alternatives would have to be devised, with the best tool probably being the mending cantrip, which allows a whole host of devious steganographic shenanigans.