The Vision of Charlemagne

[fusangite]

My whole understanding of Lord of the Rings changed recently with my discovery of a 9th century document called The Vision of Charlemagne. It divides the Carolingian Empire into three ages:
I. Raht
II. Radoleiba
III. Nasg
IV. Enti

Raht is the age of "abundance." Radoleiba is the age of lesser abundance when "certain peoples, now subdued will break away." Nasg is the age of decline when the Franks are sundered into three kingdoms. And Enti is the age that is "either the end of the world itself or the end of our line."

So, if we substitute the Noldor for the Franks, the four ages work quite well:
(a) the similarity between Nasg and Nazg is just too great to dismiss
(b) in the third age, there are the three Noldor realms: Imaldris, Lindon and Lothlorien
(c) Elrond predicts that with the end of the third age, either the world will end or the Noldor will pass away

I had previously just applied Carolingian history to the breakup of Charlemagne's empire (Arthedain=Aquitaine, Rhudaur=Ruhr/Lotharingia, Cardolan=Germany), especially with Tolkien's deliberate use of the term "petty realms" to describe what becomes of these realms when they themselves are divided. This also nicely parallels with Gondor as Byzantium with Osigiliath as Constantinople and Minas Tirith as Nicea.

But now I think Tolkien but his interest in the Carolingians to use in many aspects of his design of Middle Earth.

What do you guys think?

 

[Mark]

It all sounds like reasonable conjecture. I've heard a number of things that Tolkien expressly denied as being related to his work in an allegorical way (WWI and II, Hitler, "The Bomb", etc.), but I don't think I've heard much mentioned (and attributed directly to him) as being an influence. Has any of what you contend been mentioned (to your knowledge) elsewhere?

 

[shilsen]

I think it's a good theory, but the belief in a series of ages culminating in one leading to destruction is common to many cultures which Tolkien borrowed from or was at least aware of. Hellenic myth has the 4 ages from the Golden to the Brazen, Teutonic myth has similar ones leading up to Ragnarok, etc. So it's hard to work out how much was intentional reworking. But the parallels you point out are definitely interesting. I wonder if there's any mention of this in his letters or notes.

 

[fusangite]

Tolkien's area of study was the early medieval period and he did specifically state that he did base Aragorn on Charlemagne so there does seem to be special attention paid to early medieval France. The rhetoric about why the house of Mardil decided not to call themselves kings is also a pretty strong pointer that this period was important for Tolkien in his construction of the narrative. Remember, Charles Martell was the ruling steward of France who defeated the Muslims at Poitiers but his sons, instead of continuing to rule in the King's name chose to have themselves proclaimed kings.

I won't dispute that Tolkien had other sources of inspiration for his four ages scheme. Still, the word "Nasg" did kind of leap off the page at me.

 

[Wombat]

While Tolkein consciously drew more material from the Eddic poems and sagas than from the tales of Charlemagne, he was very familiar with them. There is very little in LotR that is actually "new"; instead he repackaged themes, ideas, and words that were so old most people had forgotten them. Even the Elvish script is based on certain styles of medieval handwriting (just regroup the minims in a new manner, and poof).

So, yes, this is potentially a serious source for Middle Earth background