Throwing vs. Archery

[Storyteller01]

As a note, I once calculated the actual distance a jai-alai ball could travel with the proper arc if it begins its flight at 160 miles per hour ... and it was impressive. Needless to say, the PCs were surprised when their ship was nailed by multiple glass spheres filled with alchemist fire while they were still far out to sea ...

As a side note, if allowed as a standard weapon, I recommend a 50' range with up to 20 range increments with the cesta (the jai-alai 'glove' or 'scoop') and pelota (the balls). It is a pain to aim those things at any distance ...

The book itself gave its version a 100' Range inc., but it was to be treated as throwing (max range 500'). Just recently bought the book, so I may give halflings weapons familiarity with the weapon (The sport of choice for any respectable halfling!!).

 

[jgsugden]

Sorry for the hijack, folks ... we'll carry this to a different thread after this ...

The book itself gave its version a 100' Range inc., but it was to be treated as throwing (max range 500'). Just recently bought the book, so I may give halflings weapons familiarity with the weapon (The sport of choice for any respectable halfling!!).

I was shooting from memory, but I just looked up how I actually determined the characteristics, and what those characteristics were for my game. I was off by a bit from what I used.

Using a velocity of 150 MPH, the pelota can travel roughly 1/3 of a mile if it has a 60 degree angle. This takes about 2 full rounds (12 seconds).

If this is treated as the maximum distance, the missile should travel roughly 1800 feet at maximum. If we use 20 range increments, that would be about 100 feet per increment (with some significant rounding). If we use 10 range increments, that would be about 200 feet per increment.

Thus, I decided to use 20 increments with a 100 foot increment and a base -2 penalty.

I know that this system breaks down when applied to other weapons, like arrows, which can actually travel a mile or more in the air with the proper bow. I still like it.

As a further aside, I used to own a cesta and some pelotas. I managed to send a pelota nearly 1300 feet, and I was not that strong at the time. My friends and I played 'sharpshooter' with it, aiming at barrel and larger sized targets at a range of approximately 1000 feet. We rarely hit anything ....

 

[Jhulae]

Call the shuriken a "throwing dagger" so you don't get accusations of "Ninja!" and let Magic Weapon work on 50 at a time.

Shuriken operate as 'ammunition' under 3.5. This means you can use them on a full attack action without needing quickdraw, can enchant 50 at a time with Magic Weapon, and they now suffer the 50% broken/lost quality of arrows, bolts, and other ammunition.

 

[BullMarkOne]

Bow/Xbow/Sling

Of the above three sling rules all. Sure the damage dice itself is junk, but they're free, and ammo can be free (if you're willing to take the drop in damage die). Can you say flaming or frost or shock sling? Did I also mention that you dont have to pay extra to apply strength bonuses to damage with slings.

 

[Shadowdweller]

Undecided.

Bows/Missile Weapons definitely have the advantage of range and magicability, but I'm still waiting to see one of my PCs abuse the Brutal/Power Throw feats from CAdv. I'm not completely sure about how the rules interact, but I BELIEVE (IIRC) thrown weapons can also get enchantments not normally allowed on missile weapons (Vorpal throwing axe).

 

[interwyrm]

Bows are two-handed weapons.
All slings and thrown weapons can be used with a shield
Crossbows can also be used with one hand, but if you hold a shield, I don't know if you can reload.

Also... you could technically use 2 weapon fighting with throwing weapons. And rapid shot at the same time? Would you get an extra throw with each arm?

I am also pretty sure that you can put melee weapon enhancements on all throwing weapons as most are also melee weapons.

I don't understand why a javelin does less damage than an arrow. Makes no sense.

Can you throw alchemist's fire with a sling?

 

[ARandomGod]

Bows are two-handed weapons.
All slings and thrown weapons can be used with a shield

Nope. Slings are two handed. Or at least they take two hands to reload. And you can only reload once per round, the "rapid reload" feat does not include slings. (Although that's a easy house rule away, but still not RAW.

Crossbows can also be used with one hand, but if you hold a shield, I don't know if you can reload.

Can you actually fire them one handed? I mean, certainly in reality one *could*, but by RAW aren't they two handed?

Also... you could technically use 2 weapon fighting with throwing weapons. And rapid shot at the same time? Would you get an extra throw with each arm?

No, you'd only get one extra shot. One for each two weapon fighting AND rapid shot, admittedly. So there is a big plus there. Of course, for anything other than shiruken you have to also take the "rapid draw" feat.

I am also pretty sure that you can put melee weapon enhancements on all throwing weapons as most are also melee weapons.

Very true. Although there is some debate on some of those things. Spell storing and Vampiric touch, for instance. Can you really DO that on a dagger and have it work if you throw the dagger?

I don't understand why a javelin does less damage than an arrow. Makes no sense.

True. A javelin really should do more damage...

Can you throw alchemist's fire with a sling?

Nope. Not with a conventional (RAW) sling.

 

[Patryn of Elvenshae]

Can you actually fire them one handed? I mean, certainly in reality one *could*, but by RAW aren't they two handed?

Yes, and yes.

Crossbow, Hand: You can draw a hand crossbow back by hand. Loading a hand crossbow is a move action that provokes attacks of opportunity.
[/b]You can shoot, but not load, a hand crossbow with one hand at no penalty. You can shoot a hand crossbow with each hand, but you take a penalty on attack rolls as if attacking with two light weapons.

And etc. for the other varieties.

 

[Krelios]

/nitpick

A Jai Alai ball couldn't begin its trajectory with a speed of 160mph. It would begin at 0mph and rapidly accelerate to 160mph. Just be sure that you used acceleration, gravity and arc in your distance calculations...

/nitpick off

 

[likuidice]

versitality for throwing weapons. the majority, such as throwing axes are also useable as melee weapons. all the weapon specific feats you take will apply to your melee and ranged weapons.

thrown weapons also gives the option to have more attaacks than any other character.
Monk/fighter +flurry+ all 3 2 weapon feats +rapid shot +shuriken +optional haste. 10 attacks. throw in brutal throw and improved rapidshot for a storm of nastiness,

Still, a bow for longer ranged targets is useful.