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5E Tired of doing WotC's job

Well, it has been a while since I've posted on Enworld. After 18 months of 5E, I think I am soon to be done with it.
Cool. Can I have your stuff? :p

Some questions arose:
is it magical? can you detect it with*detect magic*? if so, why can't you use dispel magic? is the target aware they are cursed? and so on.
To answer those questions: No. No. Because the only thing dispel magic does is stop currently-running spells. No - the first time the character is aware something is wrong with them is when they wake up naked in a ditch, covered in blood, and with ten hours of missing memory. "What have I done?"

…making up the rules and the systems for the game because they aren't there in the first place is just getting annoying IMO.
Yep, I feel your pain there. "Stealth". shudder

Your gear point is a good one. If a character wants to buy some clothes that would not embarrass them in at a Waterdhavian ball, how much will those cost? Who knows?
 

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pemerton

Legend
Well, there is certainly a sweet spot for how many rules are enough. A game can be defined on a single page or less. You can go to the opposite end of the spectrum and require a bookshelf full of rules to run a game properly.

D&D 5E seems to have hit that sweet spot for a whole heck of a lot of people but there is no pleasing everyone.
I'd go back to the point that it is possible to enjoy multiple RPGs.

I enjoy 4e D&D. That's a mechanically complicated game - it has rather intricate combat rules, very intricate PC build rules, and even though it's non-combat resolution is simple in comparison, it can be influenced by many of those PC build elements.

I also enjoy Cthulhu Dark. The rules for that game fit on a single A4 sheet. A character is defined by an occupation (which is not chose from a list - you just say what your PC's job is) and a sanity rating that starts at 1 and has you out of the game if it reaches 6.

And there are a range of other games I enjoy too.

For me, what is more important than the length or complexity of a system's rules is how comprehensive they are (relative to genre and play expectations) and how effective they are. One reason the AD&D rules are long is that there are so many discrete subsystems dealing with doors, traps and treasure chests. 3E was notorious for having a discrete, long and complete system just for grappling.

Conversely, Cthulhu Dark uses the same resolution system for everything, and it can be described in less than a page.
 

Maxperson

Morkus from Orkus
PHB page 150:

Clothes, common 5 sp, 3 lb
Clothes, costume 5 gp, 4 lb
Clothes, fine 15 gp, 6 lb
Clothes, traveler's 2 gp, 4 lb
...
Robes 1 gp, 4 lb

Also, on page 157, in the Trade Goods section you can find that 1 square yard of linen costs 5 gp and 1 square yard of silk costs 10 gp.

I know it's not specifically a cloak, but I think you can made do with this info.
Apparently I will never have a PC become a clothing maker. It takes about 5 square yards of material to make a set of clothes, so it would take 25gp worth of linen to make 2gp traveler's clothes. That's a money maker!!
 

Fenris-77

Small God of the Dozens
Supporter
Apparently I will never have a PC become a clothing maker. It takes about 5 square yards of material to make a set of clothes, so it would take 25gp worth of linen to make 2gp traveler's clothes. That's a money maker!!
It's impossible under the RAW anyway, there are no Tailor tools. :p There are Weaver's tools though, so maybe you can get in on the money end...

Even better, maybe come up with a linen-cotton blend and market it as linen, then you can take advantage of the 5sp/sq yd cost on cotton cloth and really make a killing.
 


Mistwell

Legend
I seem to recall the playtest version of 5e said PCs could automatically afford any amount of mundane equipment. Essentially "You don't need the price of a cloak - if you want a cloak you just go get one."
 



Helldritch

Adventurer
Linen cost a lot because it was used to make armor. Linen armor. Yep. Linen armor. And it was a good one at that. Not perfect but it was sturdy enough. It was composed of many layers of linen and glue. It was harder than leather, more resistant but prone to flea and lices. It was a blend of wool and linen that was the choice for clothing. Yes there were linen clothes, and a lot. But they were backed with wool. That is why sheeps were so well protected.
 

Linen cost a lot because it was used to make armor. Linen armor. Yep. Linen armor. And it was a good one at that. Not perfect but it was sturdy enough. It was composed of many layers of linen and glue. It was harder than leather, more resistant but prone to flea and lices. It was a blend of wool and linen that was the choice for clothing. Yes there were linen clothes, and a lot. But they were backed with wool. That is why sheeps were so well protected.
If only they had carbon epoxy...
 

Undrave

Hero
Apparently I will never have a PC become a clothing maker. It takes about 5 square yards of material to make a set of clothes, so it would take 25gp worth of linen to make 2gp traveler's clothes. That's a money maker!!
This is the old 'Split ladder to make 10 foot pole' scam to another level!

Maybe cloth is cheaper if you buy in bulk? :p
 

Fenris-77

Small God of the Dozens
Supporter
Hmm, I think we may need 10' poles in bulk anyway ... @Undrave, maybe you want to get in on the ground floor as the 10' pole supplier? I'll look into sourcing some cotton for the mix, and we can leave @Maxperson on the Linen end. Maxundris Fine Linens, Est. 2020. I like it. We can get @pemerton to draft us a fancy-sounding prospectus and we can start looking for investors.

You know, I think I've played this campaign before....
 

Helldritch

Adventurer
Ho and let's not forget about Gambeson armor that was also made with linen on the exterior and cloth fabric on the interior. It was pretty much a part of every set of armor (especially plate) that would be put underneath. In addition, gambeson was more flexible that the linen (linothorax) armor worn by the greek (and I would guess that some of the leather armors so talked about (and often contested) were in fact linothorax armor). Here I am not saying that leather armor did not exist. It did. But linothorax would be cheaper to make and gambeson was easier to make.

10' foot poles were costly because they were sturdy enough to be used as shafts for polearms. Not the ladders which were made of relatively soft wood. Hard wood was reserved for wood structures, housing, military stuff (polearms, catapults, trebuchet etc...). So using a 10' ladder to make two 10' foot poles would not give the desired result as the 10' pole would be too flexible to be used in the way that the players would want it to be. Maybe tying them together might work...
 

Maxperson

Morkus from Orkus
Hmm, I think we may need 10' poles in bulk anyway ... @Undrave, maybe you want to get in on the ground floor as the 10' pole supplier? I'll look into sourcing some cotton for the mix, and we can leave @Maxperson on the Linen end. Maxundris Fine Linens, Est. 2020. I like it. We can get @pemerton to draft us a fancy-sounding prospectus and we can start looking for investors.

You know, I think I've played this campaign before....
Acquisitions Incorporated?
 


Hmm, I think we may need 10' poles in bulk anyway ... @Undrave, maybe you want to get in on the ground floor as the 10' pole supplier? I'll look into sourcing some cotton for the mix, and we can leave @Maxperson on the Linen end. Maxundris Fine Linens, Est. 2020. I like it. We can get @pemerton to draft us a fancy-sounding prospectus and we can start looking for investors.

You know, I think I've played this campaign before....
What if I want 10' poles made out of specific woods? Ash? Cedar? Quartersawn White Oak? Bubinga? Desert Ironwood?

I demand prices for these variations! I suppose, if we assume a default wood of, say, Yellow Pine, I could then look at some wood suppliers online, compare the price of other species to Yellow Pine, and then do some arithmetic. But then I'd have to keep a log of seasonal prices, probably with a trailing average, so that I'd know how much it would cost in which season.

And, really, since prices vary based on local supply, I'll have to do this for different regions, and then try to map game-world regions to real-world regions.

Anything less will totally spoil my immersion.
 

Maxperson

Morkus from Orkus
What if I want 10' poles made out of specific woods? Ash? Cedar? Quartersawn White Oak? Bubinga? Desert Ironwood?

I demand prices for these variations! I suppose, if we assume a default wood of, say, Yellow Pine, I could then look at some wood suppliers online, compare the price of other species to Yellow Pine, and then do some arithmetic. But then I'd have to keep a log of seasonal prices, probably with a trailing average, so that I'd know how much it would cost in which season.
Just let me pull out my book and I can quote you a price. We can order it for you. :cool:
 


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