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D&D 5E Traps: yay or nay?

Mostly no. I largely agree with the Angry DM on this one.

Where I might use a trap is not to just do damage (or kill) somebody, but to change the tactical situation (assuming they don't discover/disarm/avoid it). A character stuck in a pit, or constrained by a bear trap, or even just unable to go back the way they came in a dungeon, can be an interesting problem to solve.
 

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Umm... What the trap actually did had nothing to do with the rest of my point. Imagine it did 500 damage if you like, or 1d4+1 and made a noise like you said, whatever. The point is, you should give your players that “oh naughty word” moment to take a reaction instead of just going immediately into the results.
I disagree. Some traps, sure! But it's not a hard and fast rule. Sometimes it's just too late by the time you triggered the trap.

But regardless of how you handle this particular thing, losing an amount of hit points less than your maximum will always be a boring outcome for a trap.
 

Mostly no. I largely agree with the Angry DM on this one.
That's funny, because I also agree with pretty much everything he said in that article and I love traps. His click rule is exactly what I was advocating in my earlier post, and the spear traps and statues thing was a highly abridged version of a more thorough example he uses in the article. Despite its title, the article is really less about traps being inherently terrible and more about the fact that most DMs don't use traps well.

He's also got a more refined version of the click rule in a more recent article about tweaking the core mechanics of 5th edition. In that he calls it the reaction rule. Well worth a read if you haven't already.
 

I have usually been against the more traditional module type traps.

Always asked myself - dont these bad guys ever get drunk? I hurt myself in a normal safety house enough... no chance i am setting up traps in the hallways.

on the other hand, especially in ruins and such, terrain is a godsend. Floors not built to collapse but collapsing on their own due to age and neglect. Slide down into oooze, well more a case of an eco-system than a trap.

Now, some exceptions for genre appropriate like say "lost tombs with traps to stop grave robbers - sure.

Setup set pieces where defenders have placed things to help with the defense - yep.

Ambushes where the "obvious cover" has punji sticks hidden or where the falling logs will make you rush onto a bridge that has been compromised or thru an illusion - sure.

but the cast majority of the simple "gotcha"... nah.

Remembering galaxy Quests where after running thru the CHOMPERS Sigourney Weaver yelled about wanting to shoot whoever wrote that.

My advice would be to any Gm spend no time of traps. Spend none of your design time on them and none of your face-to-face time on them because almost anything else you spend it on will provide more payoff. then, one day, you will be setting up a scene and... a pit or a rope or a barrel of oil will seem just right to be there. And then let it be there.
 


Yay.

And not just as a hit-point drain. Poison traps, imprisonment traps, full-on death traps, separation traps...and all preferably with a logical bypass for the local inhabitants to use.

My favourite traps are chute traps - like a pit trap except whoever falls in slides down a greased chute and winds up separated from the party. The chute's greased so unless the PC can fly...

And having the chute spit them out in a prison cell in an active community of monsters: priceless!

Lan-"or if I want to be really nasty, it spits them out the side of a cliff"-efan
 

Traps : Of course, they are one of the best feats of the game in every Edition.

But making them a logic puzzle sometimes, instead of only a series of skill checks is also what i do. It is even more fun.

And as others have written, the Placement should have some meaning. Placing them anywhere from a hollow way through the Woods to the closet in the kings Castle does not make any sense and is contraproductive unless your adventure takes place in the plane of Limbo
 

Yay, with the caveat that they need to be properly foreshadowed so players have a chance to respond to them. Notice how, in Indiana Jones, Indy usually sees the skeleton of some poor sap who got screwed over by the trap, or else the traps are clearly telegraphed by decorated tiles, or a pedestal that screams “something’s gonna happen if you pick up this idol.” That doesn’t mean the party has to be directly told when their are traps in the room, but they should be able to figure it out just by environmental context cues. It should feel like a Dark Souls game, where when you walk into a trap, your reaction is “I totally should have seen that coming!” and not “wow, this game is really unfair.” Part of how those games do it is by using consistent tells, so after the first time you walk into one, you know what to look for to avoid walking into another. Maybe in this dungeon, spear traps always come out of statues. But not every statue is a spear trap. And there's a boatload of statues in this dungeon. Now, as long as players see that first skeleton impaled by a sprung spear trap near a statue at the beginning of the dungeon, the’re going to be real cautious around statues. Or if they’re not, they definitely will be after the first time one of them gets nailed by the exact same trap that got the skeleton. They can learn from the environment, ok, statues in this dungeon mean there might be a spear trap. Now they have the tools to avoid them. Now it’s not just a gotcha or an hp tax, it’s a dungeon-wide incentive for players to pay attention to the environment.

Also, traps need to give the players a split second to react. It should never just be “You stepped on a pressure plate, make a Dexterity save or take 5 damage.” It should be, “You feel the tile of the floor sink slightly beneath your weight and hear the click as some unknown mechanism settles into place. What do you do?” Then, based on what they do, maybe give advantage or disadvantage on the save.

I don't entirely agree with any of this.

I'm not designing the dungeon as a "game" and traps are one of the areas where that really shows up. Traps are placed by intelligent creatures in intelligent locations. They are created for a certain purpose, and usually that purpose is related to something other than PC adventurers.

For example, traps to prevent thieves in the city are tailored to protect against the typical thieves of the city. Probably 1st to 3rd level thieves. Wealthier individuals would have more elaborate traps to protect more valuable things, and they would be harder to detect and/or disarm, and more disabling.

On the other hand, the tomb of an ancient wizard that wants to keep his stuff for eternity. Traps galore, magical and mundane, and very hard to detect and/or disable, and most of them designed to kill. The "foreshadowing" is the fact that the characters are choosing to enter a tomb built for/by an wizard of some power. Oh, and the fact that it has remained unsuccessfully plundered for thousands of years by other foolish adventurers just like them.

Now there may be some similarities in the traps, because the same trap-maker made them. But any decent trap-maker will also use that as a gotcha, with one being different for no reason (and any high level tomb robber will be expecting that).

The "split second to react" is called a saving throw. Depending on what they are doing, it could be more than that. But there's no "should be" about it. Again, it's all dependent upon who the trap was built by, for what purpose, and the skill of the creatures they expected to trigger the trap.

In many cases, the only reason the PCs survive (actually, they are involved in one such dungeon right now), is because the traps have either been sprung, or the tomb is so old they aren't functioning properly anymore. In this case it's both - many tomb robbers have attempted (and failed), but in the process set off more and more of the traps. Those traps that they could get around, or that reset continued to cause difficulty for later ones. But a portion of the tomb has been compromised by the elements. What was once sealed and dry now has a stream running through it, and hundreds of years of humidity have caused the wooden portions of the tomb to rot away, and iron and steel portions to rust, and poisons have lost their potency. The traps are often still dangerous, but not anywhere close to the degree they once were.

The second part of the tomb was more protected from the elements although it too had been plundered. The foreshadowing was the dead corpses they found, some of them still impaled a la "Indiana Jones"

Because the world is full of tomb robbers (adventurers, monsters, etc.), magic, and the elements, a great many tombs are in this state to one degree or another. But none of this has anything to do with designing for the PCs. It's all based on a world-building approach and what makes sense. And the players have to consider that when they decide they're going to enter someplace or not. Right now they are leaving the tomb because they've decided it looks too dangerous to continue. They will return later, possibly in a year or more (in-world and game time) like they've done before.
 

Traps should never deal 5 damage and have no other effect, period. It's not enough to kill anyone outright, it's not enough to knock out most characters, and even the few people that have 5 hitpoints are likely to survive it (even if they're on their own!), so unless the denizens regularly patrol their traps, it's not going to be useful at all.

If you have a damage dealing trap, either make it actually deadly (and telegraph it if you are unwilling to kill characters), or give it secondary effects (like a loud noise that prompts denizens to take action).

Don't have a trap that is "cross off hitpoints and continue like nothing happens".

I disagree. Most traps will be designed to deal with the 80%. That is, 80% of the populace has 10 hp or less, for example. So traps that deal 15-20 hit points are probably fairly common as you don't need more. Again, it's all dependent upon who created it and why. It costs coin to design and build a trap, so why build more than is needed?

In a recent dungeon the PCs found a lot of traps, many of which were set right out in the open (as deterrents). Most weren't terribly difficult for the PCs to bypass, because they were set either by goblins or troglodytes who are fighting over terrain in that particular part of the dungeon. The traps weren't all that deadly to to the 7th level PCs because they were designed to deter goblins or troglodytes. But they still had to be dealt with, regardless. The biggest challenge they presented was safe (and quick) escape routes when the PCs felt the need to run away. They complicated things considerably then.
 

That's funny, because I also agree with pretty much everything he said in that article and I love traps. His click rule is exactly what I was advocating in my earlier post, and the spear traps and statues thing was a highly abridged version of a more thorough example he uses in the article. Despite its title, the article is really less about traps being inherently terrible and more about the fact that most DMs don't use traps well.

He's also got a more refined version of the click rule in a more recent article about tweaking the core mechanics of 5th edition. In that he calls it the reaction rule. Well worth a read if you haven't already.

I like the click rule when it makes sense. That is, if the players are being cautious and have time to react. Otherwise, their moment is a "damn, I set off a trap" moment.
 

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