Trek Spoiler Spectacular! (Forked Thread: The new Star Trek movie is...)

[Pbartender]

[digresson]Alright... Maybe one of you guys can help me out.

What I'm looking for is an image of Simon Pegg as Scotty. Specifically, an image of him during the scene in which he's talking about "Admiral Archer's prized beagle", while slugging down out of a big mug. If anyone has the net-fu to find it, I'd really appreciate it.

All I can seem to find is the "It's exciting!" picture of him on the bridge soaking wet... Not exactly what I'm looking for.[/digression]

 

[Umbran]

Sure, you can invent explanations to make it make sense after the fact, but as it stands in the movie, this is a plot hole.

In the name of improving our abilities to critique - no, this is not a plot hole.

A plot hole is not something that happens for reasons that are unstated, so that we don't understand why. A plot hole is a gap or inconsistency that specifically goes against the established logic, facts, or plot.

That they have to drill into the planet does not conflict with anything we know - it is specifically the established way the Red Matter works. So it isn't a plot hole.

That Spock is left on the ice planet around a different star to witness the destruction of Vulcan *is* a plot hole, as they've established that interstellar distances are large without warp drive. You cannot see planets at interstellar distances with the naked eye, and it would take years for the vision of the destruction to travel between the stars in any event.

My No-Prize solution is that he doesn't actually physically witness, but does so psionically. The rules of psi in Trek are not well established, and it is perhaps not so bad for us to think that he could somehow "feel" the death of billions of other psionically endowed individuals a few light years away. The image they show in the movie is poetic license, not the actual thing he sees with his eyes.

 

[Pbartender]

My No-Prize solution is that he doesn't actually physically witness, but does so psionically. The rules of psi in Trek are not well established, and it is perhaps not so bad for us to think that he could somehow "feel" the death of billions of other psionically endowed individuals a few light years away. The image they show in the movie is poetic license, not the actual thing he sees with his eyes.

My No-Prize solution is that there is more than one planet in the galaxy named "Delta Vega", much as there is more than one city named "Rochester" in the world. This jibes with the fact that the "new" Delta Vega doesn't look anything like the "classic" Delta Vega. Spock's Delta Vega just happens to be in a very, very close orbit with Vulcan, and Nero timed its destruction just right for the benefit of Spock.

 

[Rykion]

[digresson]Alright... Maybe one of you guys can help me out.

What I'm looking for is an image of Simon Pegg as Scotty. Specifically, an image of him during the scene in which he's talking about "Admiral Archer's prized beagle", while slugging down out of a big mug. If anyone has the net-fu to find it, I'd really appreciate it.

All I can seem to find is the "It's exciting!" picture of him on the bridge soaking wet... Not exactly what I'm looking for.[/digression]

Here's a link to a pic with scruffy looking Scotty at his desk.
IGN: Star Trek Publicity Stills 2819795
I'll see if I can find more.

Edit
Here is a close-up of Scotty in his non-regualtion outfit.
Star Trek Wallpaper Pictures: Official Movie Site

 

[Umbran]

Spock's Delta Vega just happens to be in a very, very close orbit with Vulcan, and Nero timed its destruction just right for the benefit of Spock.

The name of the thing doesn't bother me one whit. It's the distance.

In order to get a view like that Delta Vega would have to be a moon of Vulcan (or vice-versa). Then the name does become a problem, as it would not have some generic like "Delta Vega". Plus, a Federation outpost that close to Vulcan would not have resupply issues. Scotty could have just radioed over to Vulcan for some nice plomeek soup, or Dominos pizza, or something.

That's why I moved to the psionic explanation.

 

[Rykion]

That's why I moved to the psionic explanation.

Nero just set up a holographic projector to let Spock watch the implosion.

The other thing that bothers me is the 10,000 Vulcans thing. I would consider 50,000 Vulcans being off planet a low number. Just Vulcan embassies, Starfleet members, Vulcan spacecraft, and the odd Vulcan living on another world would probably top that easy. Then the idea that a logical spacefaring race hasn't colonized a few worlds to prevent a single disaster wiping them out is mind boggling.

 

[mrtauntaun]

Pike, again, completely ignorable. He's off flying a desk. You see how deeply the character of specific Admirals impacted this movie? Zero. Expect more of same..

No, Pike is not ignorable. Not only does he recommend and praise Kirk as an Admiral (which carries a lot of weight on it's own), he does so as Kirk's former commanding officer. That's saying a lot at a time when Starfleet is still small by comparison (even more so since it just lost so many ships).

 

[Ed_Laprade]

Nope, only one was a nacelle. The other was the "cylindrical" section of the ship, like the section of the Enterprise that connects the warp nacelles with the saucer section's "neck."

I definitely saw one of the 'rescue fleet' light off three nacelles before going into warp. Unfortunately I didn't get a good look at any of the ships, as I was trying to look closely at all of them, and they didn't stick around long enough for that.

 

[fireinthedust]

I was going to start a new thread, but I'll post here:


WHY VULCAN HAD TO DIE:

It's all about the symbolism for what's going on with the franchise, while not alienating die hard continuity fans by demanding that they forget that everything happened.

Vulcan is symbolic for Logic, the logic of the franchise that came before. Spock is symbolic for that franchise, which was a mix of human emotion and Trek-Logic.

The film is a revamping of the franchise, but the idea of Star Trek is such that one cannot simply do a non-canon movie for the fans WHILE AT THE SAME TIME as a writer it is near-impossible to do a good film with bundles of old plots and logic(s) hanging around clogging things up.

The villain (aka: that which moves the plot forward) goes back in time to before everything started and screws with time. More specifically, explodes the logic-planet IN, I suppose, a bid to get back at Spock (who was just trying to save their world). Spock survives, along with only 10 000 vulcans, rescuing as many of the culture-people as he can, and is going to try to save his people.

Our view: the movie: JJ Abrams takes the old franchise and blows it up, but goes back in time to do this. What does he use? The Logic, the Star Trek stuff that really matters, and gets rid of the rest; from 6 billion worries to 10000, from a story-teller's POV.

Spock symbolizes also the old franchise. He is all the stored memories of the old timelines, technologies, mathematics, whatever. He's an ARC, in a way. He's also the production's way of saying "we're keeping the past, and using it as a guide as we move forward". It's... well, it's a pledge during this revamp, that retconning will (hopefully) not be disrespectful.

I liked the movie, and this idea. What weirds me out is that none of the episodes I remember actually happened now. No trouble with Tribbles, no Amok time, no Picard, no Data... well, not yet. Eventually yes, but we'll see changes.

We might also see T'Pol make an appearance in the next film, or Tuvok, or some other interesting stuff. Heh, in this continuity have Klingons transformed into big-forehead guys like Worf?! heheheheh.

 

[Rykion]

Heh, in this continuity have Klingons transformed into big-forehead guys like Worf?!

They should have both versions of Klingons as explained in Enterprise. Evidently they have head ridges on their helmets at least, oh and they wear trench coats. As seen in pics and discussion here: JJ Abrams Talks Deleted Scenes - Find Out What Didn’t Make Final Cut of ‘Star Trek’ | TrekMovie.com