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UA UA feats, are they trying to allow people to not have to multiclass to get class abilities?

dnd4vr

The Smurfiest Wizard Ever!
From day 1 I always thought this was a primary feature of feats.

Many of them in the PHB are features that some classes get but others don't.
I never thought of it this way, but that is very true. From the PHB we have:

Dual Wielder - related to Two-Weapon Fighting Style
Dungeon Delver - related to Thieves' Tools
Great Weapon Master - related to Great Weapon Fighting Style
Healer - related to healing magic by those classes
Magic Initiate - related to Spellcasting
Martial Adept - related to Battle Master
Ritual Caster - related to spellcasting ritual spells
Shield Master - related to Protection Fighting Style

Many of these mimic, complement, or in a fashion replace the features listed. For instance, Barbarians never get Great Weapon Fighting Style, but by taking Great Weapon Master can get a similar "feel" for the concept.

Some of the new UA feats, which more directly mimic class features, are just more obvious about it.
 

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dnd4vr

The Smurfiest Wizard Ever!
Depends what spells you choose. The only time I have seen it in play the player choose Mending, Mage Hand and Find Familiar.
Agreed. The only time this was taken in the games I'm in was for Mending, Shillelagh, and Goodberry. Of course, Shillelagh was for combat, but Goodberry is (IMO) one of the best low level spells for the utility of not having to carry rations!!! To me, the 1 hp of healing is secondary.

Those three spells show a nice blend of combat and utility IMO.
 

Undrave

Hero
Believe me, as a fan of 4e, I'm sympathetic to the siloing argument. But years of debate on this topic has made it clear that there's a significant fraction of the fanbase that desires the ability to build characters who are terrible at combat if they so choose. The fact that the game is "designed around combat" is, to them, an unfortunate atavism.
"You're not a REAL role-player until you made a character who is totally useless and can only hide when things get dangerous! If you don't, you're just a ROLLplaying power gamer!!" ;)
 

jmartkdr2

Adventurer
"You're not a REAL role-player until you made a character who is totally useless and can only hide when things get dangerous! If you don't, you're just a ROLLplaying power gamer!!" ;)
Ha!

But I think it's something a little different: if you want to motivate a player to do something, tell them they're not allowed to.

Which is why the best way to keep dragonborn out of your campaign is to avoid any mention of them. If you say they're banned, at least half of your players are now building dragonborn pc's in the back of their mind.
 

MoonSong

Rules-lawyering drama queen but not a munchkin
"You're not a REAL role-player until you made a character who is totally useless and can only hide when things get dangerous! If you don't, you're just a ROLLplaying power gamer!!" ;)
It goes both ways though...
"Unless you squeeze every last bonus to max your DPR you are not a real gamer as you are misunderstanding what the game is about -go back to the depths of tumbler/whattpad where you shouldn't have escaped from you selfish weirdo-. You are ruinning our teamplay with your not entirely self-sufficient character"
 
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Pauln6

Explorer
It goes both ways though...
"Unless you squeeze every last bonus to max your DPR you are not a real gamer as you are misunderstanding what the game is about -go back to the depths of tumbler/whattpad where you shouldn't have escaped from you selfish weirdo-. You are ruinning our teamplay with your not entirely self-sufficient character"
In my experience most groups have a mixture of both types although rarely at the extremes in the same group.
 

jmartkdr2

Adventurer
In my experience most groups have a mixture of both types although rarely at the extremes in the same group.
The vast majority of players are a little bit of both. If anything, I think the skill with which they engage both side of the game (that is, the role-playing and the game) are the bigger variables, but that also changes over time. Quite rapidly for new players.
 

Horwath

Hero
Giving out Fighting Styles as feats is however the worst offender from a balance point of view rather than concept. A Fighting Style is typically really powerful because it gets used potentially every single round in every single combat. Once you choose yours, you're supposed to stick with that weapon configuration as much as possible, that's why a second Style is significantly less valuable than the first. But Styles are one of the most important things to make martial classes still be better in combat than others, especially Fighters.
fighting style is worth half a feat. At best.

and it is not treading on martial classes as it costs a feat(or half of it).

and also it comes down to class proficiency in armor/weapons and size of Hit dice in balancing issues.
 

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