D&D 5E Vecna's Dread Counterspell vs. Subtle Spell (a simple poll)

[Parmandur]

I don't recall if anyone has mentioned them yet, but honestly I was focusing on spells without them for that reason.

Either way, having a focus or component pouch in your hand is all you need. If it was already there all the time, I don't think it would be much of a clue, personally. Now, if it is a cost component--maybe.


Again, not that I recall.

IMO if an item allows you to "cast a spell", then it could be a reaction to you using the item to "cast a spell" to counter it, but I would have to review the wording to see if that would be RAW or not.

Using a material component, even a foci or pouch, is obvious to observation. Other Metamagic works for other components, however, and there are Race or Class features (Gith Paionics, for instance) that go around them.

 

[Guest 7034872]

"Simple poll."

On this site??

 

[DND_Reborn]

"Simple poll."

On this site??

I don't know if you can do a poll with only ONE option, but I suppose that would be simpler.

 

[Uni-the-Unicorn!]

How does he "just know" this? That's not listed in the statblock as far as I can see!

The how he knows (or even if he knows) is not required for the mechanics as written in natural language (aka follows the rules of the English language)

 

[Uni-the-Unicorn!]

Like...if we're talking about natural language, it's very clear that the natural language meaning of the phrase is that you have to be seeing someone cast a spell.

That is incorrect. The natural language is that which follows the rules of the language . In this case English. Several English majors, teachers, and professors have diagrammed this sentence (on these forums) and all of them agree that the correct reading of the sentence is that Vecna does not need to see the casting, just the caster. To interpret it differently is in fact unnatural.

 

[Blue]

Just as a point of interest to some, the same question will also impact creatures in the Monsters of the Multiverse book.

For example the Alhoon (Mind Flayer Lich) has:

Negate Spell (3/Day). The alhoon targets one creature it can see within 60 feet of it that is casting a spell. If the spell is 3rd level or lower, the spell fails, but any spell slots or charges are not wasted.

Same "creature it can see casting a spell".

 

[DND_Reborn]

I really, really, REALLY, REALLY think they just chose the phrase "that is" instead of "in the process of" simply because they didn't want to use the same phrasing.

Like subclass features:

• Beginning at Xth level
• When you reach Xth level
• Starting at Xth level
• After you reach Xth level
• and so on...

... are simply different phrases that all are saying the same thing.

Until JC or some other "authority" for 5E indicates otherwise, that is just the way I am going to rule it at our table.

 

[DND_Reborn]

Just as a point of interest to some, the same question will also impact creatures in the Monsters of the Multiverse book.

For example the Alhoon (Mind Flayer Lich) has:

Negate Spell (3/Day). The alhoon targets one creature it can see within 60 feet of it that is casting a spell. If the spell is 3rd level or lower, the spell fails, but any spell slots or charges are not wasted.

Same "creature it can see casting a spell".

Great point.

And if you'll notice this feature replaces the three 3rd-level slots it had prior for using counterspell:

 

[Blue]

Great point.

And if you'll notice this feature replaces the three 3rd-level slots it had prior for using counterspell:

View attachment 252469

Agreed. That seems to be the design direction for all the caster-monsters in Witchlike and Monsters of the Multiverse - leave a couple of high-flavor & usability spells once a day, and have a few spell-like action/reaction for general use.

 

[Parmandur]

Just as a point of interest to some, the same question will also impact creatures in the Monsters of the Multiverse book.

For example the Alhoon (Mind Flayer Lich) has:

Negate Spell (3/Day). The alhoon targets one creature it can see within 60 feet of it that is casting a spell. If the spell is 3rd level or lower, the spell fails, but any spell slots or charges are not wasted.

Same "creature it can see casting a spell".

Good catch! Yes, the Alhoon clearly does not need to see the casting, just the caster.