Warblade and Swordsage: Overpowered?

[Nail]

<whiny voice> Ftr: "But I wanna hang with the cool d12 classes! Mo-om! Nightfall's being unfair!"

 

[Nightfall]

To which I reply: "Fair? I didn't know I was being unfair I guess the unfair police will have to lock me up or something..." Goes on to rant about what is and isn't fair in reality if anything...

 

[catsclaw227]

According to WotC Customer Service it does. Don't have a link, but you can find it on the Character Optimization boards over at Wizards.

Basically, when you re-prepare your manuevers, they are all refreshed. Its a side effect of the feat, probably not intended RAW.

I thought that WITH adaptive style, the swordsage to get ONE maneuver back in a round of concentrating. I might be wrong here.

 

[dog45]

Holy anthropomorphic baleen whale guano, Batman! That's totally bake-your-priest and punch-a-cobra awesome! TOTALLY!!!one!

Swordsage is clearly the new black.

-- N

If that flips your lid, check out this thread - Tome of Battle Tricks-Combos-Library - Wizards Community

note: the wotc boards are down right now, but will return you to your regulary scheduled program soon.

 

[kaomera]

Question: "Why do Warblades get d12 HD?"

Unlike Bbns, warblades are not forced into having a lower AC. And the Ftr, the quintessential warrior-type, gets d10. What do Warblades lack (that Ftrs have) that warrants a d12?

They seem very nearly equal in being "forced" into having a lower AC. And a d10 vs. a d12 is only an average of one hit point per level. Due to benefiting more from points in other ability scores, the Warblade seems likely to have a point or two less Constitution, anyway (or the Fighter could take Improved Toughness). I've got a Swordsage and a Warblade in my game at the moment. They've only just made fifth level, but so far their maneuvers are simply not keeping up with the three extra Feats that a Fighter at that level would have. Mind you, with their other bonuses they are both probably slightly more "powerful" than an equal-level Fighter, but they're also not quite as easy to play well and are harder to really optimize.

 

[Nightfall]

Kao,

If people want to optimize a fighter, go fighter/rogue.

Dog,

Thanks for the link.

 

[Paradigm]

Kao,

If people want to optimize a fighter, go fighter/rogue.

Dog,

Thanks for the link.

Nah, I've run enough RPGA games to know that it is Barbarian / Fighter / Rogue.

 

[Nail]

They seem very nearly equal in being "forced" into having a lower AC.

I doubt it.

HD: Warblade is better

BAB: same

Saves: same

Skills: Warblade has a better list and more points

Armor: Ftr has Hvy Armor Proficiency, but Warblade is NOT barred from picking up the feat.

Feats: Ftr better...but that's his schtick, and meanwhile the Warblade gets.....

Maneuvers: Warblade is better. Warblade can "recharge" every other round, if desired. Pick up Adaptive Style, and he can be doing this all day.

Class Abilities: A Ftr has none, other than the feats already mentioned. A Warblade gets several that are quite useful.


Decision: Warblade. It's an easy call, really.

 

[kaomera]

If people want to optimize a fighter, go fighter/rogue.

I was saying (or at least trying to) that a Fighter (straight Fighter, mind you) would have been easier for my players to run well (in a tactical sense). We do have a slightly dysfunctional party setup, but it would really, really benefit from a well-built Fighter. The Warblade is great at slaughtering individual targets in melee, but his complete lack of ranged attacks puts the opposition in the driver's seat, and his defenses aren't really that great. The Swordsage, meanwhile, just misses all the time...

 

[brehobit]

Nah, I've run enough RPGA games to know that it is Barbarian / Fighter / Rogue.

A fighter4/barb4/swordsage1 can have a 2d6 sneak attack, d8 HD, better saves, and weapon focus in a set of weapons. Oh, and a bunch of maneuvers/fight...

I'll take the swordsage level 1 before thinking about the rogue....

Mark