D&D General What’s The Big Deal About Psionics?

Yaarel

🇮🇱He-Mage
Regarding the arcane and divine power sources, the difference is basically math versus language.

The arcane "math" includes alchemical chemistry, magical laws of physics, the magical properties of material components, potion ingredients, sophisticated technology, and similar.

The divine "language" includes symbols, archetypes, deep structures, world views, sacred texts, vows and oaths, meanings, meaning of life, and similar.

Both power sources exploit the weave, but engage it in very different ways.
 

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jgsugden

Legend
Ok, so what is it then? Design the psionic system that WotC should use and please post it here.
If possible, writeup or send an example of the kind of mechanics that you have in mind. It is ok if from an earlier edition, enough to get a sense of it. Then I can give a more helpful critique.

I will mainly scrutinize it for balance for the context of 5e, but flavor including how mechanics actualize flavor is also important.
I'll post the basics for you, but be cognizant of what you're attempting to do here: You're going to attempt to critique a system used for 20 years, that was enjoyed by many players, based upon a high level overview. I admire your confidence in your abilities, but have extreme doubts as to the utility of the exercise. Putting aside that scrutinizing for balance without seeing an entire system is kind of a pointless exercise, here are the basics of the system I used from 3E that I still, currrently, have been working in 'behind the scenes' for NPCs and monsters in 5E (and for a couple one shot PCs).

1.) Psionic PCs gain a number of Defenses/Attacks. Most of the classes get to pick the ratio. For example, a first level Psion would get 4, which could be 4 defenses, 4 attacks, or a combination that mixes them. A high level Psion is the only class that historically could get all 10. They also gain powers, which are separate from attacks/defenses, although not entirely separate as discussed below. They also gain a number of psionic power points to power their abilities - the mechanics for how many PPs were obtained and how many each attack/defense/power cost changed to adapt to the editions.

2.) Each defense grants a minor defensive ability when up. While there is a tendency for these to be helpful against psionic abilities, they have broader uses. There is a cost to invoke them, and a cost to maintain them (although there are class mechanics that reduce these costs). You can have as many defenses up at a time as you want (up to the maximum of the 5 that exist). These changed over the editions to adjust to the current rule set. At low levels, you'd need to use your entire action to set up one defense. Abilities gained as you leveled up would allow for more efficienct ways to set up defenses. In 5E terminology, you might get the ability to put up a defense as a reaction, as a bonus action, or the ability to initiate multiple defenses as an action.

3.) Each attack has an effect when initiated, and then a lingering effect. You have to pay a cost to keep that lingering effect going, but similar to psionic defenses, there are mechanics to reduce these costs. Over the edditions the effects changed to accomodate the current rule set. However, the tendency was that only one dealt damage directly, while others did things like move a target, restrict their movement, made them more vulnerable to certain damage, etc... The real kicker of the lingering effect was that a target subject to one of these lingering effects would also be suscpetible to additional seconday effects for psionic powers. Like defenses, as you advance, you'd obtain more efficient ways to invoke psionic attacks allowing for multiple to be unloaded at a time on a target, or for multiple targets to be hit at once.

4.) The 5 defenses and 5 offenses have a 'rock-paper-scissors' style interaction. Each attack has one defense, that if active on the target, strongly reduces the initial attack effect and stops the lingering effect. It also has two defenses, that if active on the target, stop the lingering effect (but have no impact on the initial effect). So, if you have 2 psionic defenses that are not 'adjacent' and both are up, you'd seem to be protected from lingering effects of psionic attacks (but see below).

5.) The baseline for balance is that a target has no psionic defenses. This means that a psionic character with defenses has greater ability to defend against psionic attack, generally speaking. Much like wizards are better at fighting wizards than a fighter is, especially historically, a psion is better at defending against a psion.

6.) However, when a psionic attack targets a character with a psionic defense that reduces the effectiveness of the psionic attack, there is a way for the psionic attack to 'break' the defense. The rules for this changed over the years, with simple dice rolls used at times, and with a more complex card based system used at others (designed by a player - very cool and iconic, but too time consuming). Regardless, the way this usually played out was that when psionic PCs fought each other, they would accelerate their power point usage to break defenses and restore their defenses extra times.

7.) For each power that a psionic character has (which is different than a psionic attack or psionic defense), there is a primary ability, and then secondary abilities that can be added if there is a creature currently subject to a lingering effect within range.

8.) Each psionic classes had class abilities that were not tied to attacks, defenses and powers as well.

9.) You had a maximum number of psionic power points. When you rested, you recovered half of what you were down, with a minimum number that you'd recover. This meant that if you depleted yourself entirely, it could take a while before you fully recovered (days), while if you kept yourself from depleting too many, you'd stay at full strength. The way this played out is that PCs tried to avoid going too deep into their reserves - but when the big finale came up they could dig into those deep reserves and go for it.

Those are the basics, but there is a lot more to it.

Here is an example of how it all plays out together: Dryxus the Psion is standing in the back of the party as their sneaky barbarian opens the door and reveals a Psionic Illithid (built using these rules) and several thralls. The other PCs engage the thralls and Dryxus engages the Illithid. Dryxus goes before the Illithid in initiative. Before the door was opened, Dryxus had established two psionic defenses (Intellect Fortress, which is best against Mind Blast and assists versus Id Insinuation and Psychic Crush), and Mental Barrier (which is best against Ego Whip and assists versus Psychic Crush and Mind Thrust).

Dryxus gets to go before the Illithid. As a Psion, Dryxus has a probe ability that allows him to spend a PP to see what psionic defense a target has up. He uses that ability and discovers that the Illithis has an Intellect Fortress protecting it, but no other defenses up. This means that he is most vulnerable to the Ego Whip and Mind Thrust attacks, as the Intellect Fortress provides no benefit against them - leaving the Illithid as vulnerable as a non-psion to those attacks, and allowing him to use powers with riders based up lingering effects from those attacks to work. He uses an action to do a dual psionic attack, launching both the Ego Whip and Mind Thrust at the target. There are two saving throws, both failed. The Illithid is knocked prone by the Ego Whip (initial effect) and pushed 5 feet by the Mind Thrust (initial effect). Further, Dryxus pays to keep the lingering effects going for both attacks, resulting in a limited vulnerability to psychic damage from the Ego Whip and a 'start of turn' chance (likely a saving throw in 5E) to be pushed back by the Mind Thrust.

The Illithid goes next. The Illithid has a series of options here to respond. They might add a psychic defense such as Mental Barrier or Thought Shield to protect themselves from the lingering effect of the Ego Whip and Mind Thrust. Or, they might go on the offensive and focus on an attack as spending all their time on defense and nothing on offense may mean they can try to outlast the Psion, but it wastes their power and there are other threats in the room as well. They have an ability that allows them to use Mind Blast whenever they us a Psionic Power. They do not know that Dryxus is prepared with the best defense against a Mind Blast, so they target Dryxus with the Mind Blast as part of using their 'Swallow Will' power. Because Dryxus has that Intellect Fortress Up, the Mind last will not impact him this turn, but there is a possibility that the Intellect Fortress will be broken by the Mind Blast and be dropped. As mentioned above, we've used a variety of mechanics for determining how this works, and in 5E I would likely have the mechanics tied to monster design / class design. Let's say that it breaks the Intellect Fortress (ending that defense for Dryxus). However, when the Swallow Will power is used on Dryxus, he would not be subject to the 'Mind Blast' secondary benefit listed in the power because there is no Mind Blast lingering effect on him.

Powers had some similarities to spells, but there were distinct differences between spells and powers. The 'tiers' of effect they might have based upon which lingering effects derived from the psionic attacks that were in play were one significant difference. Another was that they would be customized based upon your PP expenditure. For example, a single target power could be augmented to include additional targets, a greater range, higher damage, etc...

Psionic characters had far fewer 'powers' than spellcasting classes had spells (historically - the reduction in spells available in 5E would impact how this was approached). Psions had the most powers, with psychic warriors having far fewer (and fewer PPs). The idea here was to emulate the feel of a super hero with a smaller breadth of a tool set than a wizard might have - but greater use cases for each tool they had.

Power designs originated from the materials from WotC/TSR, but they evolved away from the books so that by the time we approached the end of 3.5, my system was essentially entirely homebrew, but you could see where elements originated in the rules.

How easy was it to follow and understand these rules? It was a step up from your basic wizard, but players understood it pretty quickly and thoroughly, especially when they played a psionic PC. If you were not playing a psionic PC, you didn't need to understand the inner workings... but most players picked it up as they watch the psionic PCs.

On top of all of this were some of the historical 'meta' rules of psionics that applied across the board. For example, they were not magic, so detect magic/dispel magic had no impact. However, wizards did develop magics to detect psionics and fight psionic abilities. They were uncommon, as psionics were very uncommon themselves, but they did exist.

There was more to it - we did not discuss hwo sciences and disciplines impacted the availability of powers to learn, for example, but that is the core of it.
 

Yaarel

🇮🇱He-Mage
@jgsugden

I appreciate your effort explaining your experience and will consider it.

I love 4e and 5e. I have played in a 3e group. I have played in a 1e group, where some 2e material was infused, but mostly akin to houserules for 1e, with all player-facing content being 1e, and the UA modified. I never played 2e per se.

I did play 1e psionics, whence I know its horrifying mechanics. The talents are cool but ranging from worthless to game-breaking. The psionic combat minigame is disruptive and unfair to other gamers.

I have no familiarity with the 2e Psionicist, which seems to be the main inspiration for weird psionic mechanics: something like a skill system?

I love 3e Psion and psionics. The 3e Psion is a full spellcaster (aka power-manifester) and is my hope for 5e. I also appreciate the gishy Psywar.

You mention using psionic combat in 3e. I am unsure what you are talking about. We use the Expanded Psionic Handbook, I dont recall it being in there, and we never used anything like psionic combat in 3e. What 3e psionic combat?

4e psionic was disappointing. The 4e system of at-will, encounter, and daily, as well as using the same power mechanics as the Wizard and all other classes, is already perfect for psionic. But the purposelessly weird mechanics killed 4e psionics for me. And the squick flavor for psionic got on my nerves.

5e is painful without psionic support. But I see the 5e designers are trying. The little bit that the designers have been able to get past the 60% approval rating is pretty good: the psionic subclasses and the psionic feat. I especially like the Psi Knight, and consider Warlock and Sorcerer as appropriate for squick flavor.

Personally, I consider the 5e Bard to already be a psionic class, as simple as adding the innate psionic tag to Bard spellcasting, but as a special class flavor requiring verbal speech to focus psionic visualizations.

But I still want a 5e Psion full spellcaster, like the 3e Psion.

I also want a gishy 5e Mystic that feels like a 3e Psywar, and am comfortable merging it with the 2e Psionicist whatever it is. Ideally, this "gish" has no Fighter mechanics, but instead uses psionic for all melee attacks, so the sword or claw deals force or acid damage. Things like that.


I mention my experience with psionics, so you have a sense of where I am coming from when I critique your experience with it.
 
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jgsugden

Legend
@jgsugden
...
You mention using psionic combat in 3e. I am unsure what you are talking about. We use the Expanded Psionic Handbook, I dont recall it being in there, and we never used anything like psionic combat in 3e. What 3e psionic combat?
Again, the version I ran was an enhanced version of the core rules system, and was evolved on top of the evolution that came from AD&D through 2E and into 3E (and then was an awkward fit but still used to an extent in the very different 4E world).

The rules for psionic combat exist in the 3E (Not Expanded) Psionics Handbook. The rules are, IIRC, right before the Powers listing. They feature a bit of 'This defense works better against that attack', but it is more convoluted than the rules I used. IIRC, the Expanded book eliminated the Psionic Combat and folded the attacks and defenses in as powers - a move that made psionic PCs feel more like another version of a wizard. While my recollection is that we tweaked some of our approach to psionics when the expanded book came out, for the most part we did not build around it as our approach was sufficiently distinct.
...
I also want a gishy 5e Mystic that feels like a 3e Psywar, and am comfortable merging it with the 2e Psionicist whatever it is. Ideally, this "gish" has no Fighter mechanics, but instead uses psionic for all melee attacks, so the sword or claw deals force or acid damage. Things like that.
...
In my systems, the Psychic Warrior remained most inspired by Jedi/Sith concepts, but they had access to a lot of powers that allowed them to modify their attacks, bodies, etc... (mostly psychometabolic, but amongst the other disciplines as well). While your concept would not be "the way" for a psychic warrior under my version of rules, it would be "a way".

Most psychic warriors tended to be able to use their mental abilities to augment their fighting capabilities, allowing them greater mobility (and benefits for using that mobility - for example, there was a power that allowed them to make a single weapon attack that was then applied to every creature that was adjacent to them during their movement - that was a favorite way to clear fodder), battlefield control (telekenisis style effects to move combatants, etc...), deception in combat (for example, a power that made enemies see and believe that a friend and enemy had swapped places), etc...

However, there were psychic warriors that went in a very different direction. One built himself to be a horror story monster that would convert into a 'death fog', envelop enemies, sap their lifeforce to feed his own PP needs, and then raise their corpses to fight for him. This was achieved through Psychometabloic powers that enlarged him and converted him into gas, Psychokinetic powers that modified life forces (which were delivered as attacks), and Metacreative powers that would fill the husks with Astral Constructs that would wear the bodies like shells. That ended up being the main trick for this PC, but that is how psionics worked compared to spellcasters - fewer tricks, more versatility with each trick.
 

Yaarel

🇮🇱He-Mage
I'll post the basics for you, but be cognizant of what you're attempting to do here: You're going to attempt to critique a system used for 20 years, that was enjoyed by many players, based upon a high level overview. I admire your confidence in your abilities, but have extreme doubts as to the utility of the exercise.
My hope for the discussion is to arrive at a win-win for all 5e psionic fans.

Putting aside that scrutinizing for balance without seeing an entire system is kind of a pointless exercise, here are the basics of the system I used from 3E that I still, currrently, have been working in 'behind the scenes' for NPCs and monsters in 5E (and for a couple one shot PCs).
When I look at your system I will be exploring how it or something like it might work in the context of 5e.

1.) Psionic PCs gain a number of Defenses/Attacks.
Quick question, is it like 1e where a psionic combatant can only attack an other psionic combatant, and unable to affect a nonpsionic target? If so, this is the part that made 1e problematic narratively and mechanically. Narratively, for example, the mindflayer could Psionic Blast nonpsionic targets. A telepath can communicate with a nonpsionic, so weaponizing this should be possible against nonpsionics too. Mechanically, the psi combat minigame shut down the rest of the game for other 1e players that were nonpsionic.

Before moving on to consider your system, the 1e psionic combat system might work in 5e as a system of spells (cantrips) and counterspells. Suppose the system simplifies to only three psicantrips for psicombat (so it really is like rock-paper-scissors). Each cantrip attacks both psionic and nonpsionic targets alike, and targets save normally against when appropriate. However each cantrip can also be used for a reaction that counterspells one of the other two psicombat cantrip. The three cantrips can use higher spell slots to augment the effect and to increase the DC versus counterspelling.

Most of the classes get to pick the ratio. For example, a first level Psion would get 4, which could be 4 defenses, 4 attacks, or a combination that mixes them. A high level Psion is the only class that historically could get all 10.
Maybe keep it simpler with three psicombat cantrips. There can be other psionic cantrips with psionic effects, but only three cantrips for psicombat. The psicombat tends toward complex, three cantrips are probably enough to get that rock-paper-scissors feel.

They also gain powers, which are separate from attacks/defenses
The psionic "powers: can be 5e spells or class feature effects that are nonspells. No problem.

although not entirely separate as discussed below.
To augment psionic powers (whether cantrips, higher spells, or nonspell class features), I am looking at Warlock Invocations that can modify any spell or feature, as ad hoc case-by-case option.

They also gain a number of psionic power points to power their abilities - the mechanics for how many PPs were obtained
For 5e, the higher spell slots (or its eqivalent in spell points) to augment a spell effect. It seems also possible to use slots (or equivalent points) to augment class features that arent spells.

and how many each attack/defense/power cost changed to adapt to the editions.
Each edition of D&D has its own way of doing things, such as 5e using spell slots as a design space. "At higher levels", the spell slots (or their equivalent spell points) can augment cantrips or any feature.

2.) Each defense grants a minor defensive ability when up. While there is a tendency for these to be helpful against psionic abilities, they have broader uses.
Cool, I think it might be neat if each psionic combat cantrip is dual-use, with both an attack an a defense (as well as a counterspell against one of the other two cantrips).

Reaction is a great mechanic, but it slows down the game, and can be a frustration to other players. So reactions for psionic effects must be sparse and judicious.

There is a cost to invoke them, and a cost to maintain them (although there are class mechanics that reduce these costs).
5e cantrips seem a good model. Some require concentration, some dont, some have long duration, some might be maintained be recasting it each round. On top of this slots/points can boost a psionic cantrip to "augment" it "at higher levels".

You can have as many defenses up at a time as you want (up to the maximum of the 5 that exist). These changed over the editions to adjust to the current rule set. At low levels, you'd need to use your entire action to set up one defense.
Suppose we have a 5e psionic cantrip. It has two effects: an attack effect and a defense effect. Perhaps the defense effect needs to be up, in order to use the attack effect. (In away the cantrip is something like a Fighter "stance".) To keep the defense effect up may or may not require concentration, depending on mechanical balance.

In addition, slots/points can augment the cantrip effect.

And, the defense can be used to counterspell one of the other two psionic combat cantrip attacks.

Note, it should be possible to build a psionic class without these psionic cantrips, by choosing other cantrips instead. But if the psionic combat cantrips are cool, there will be players who want to choose them for their character concept.


Abilities gained as you leveled up would allow for more efficienct ways to set up defenses.
For 5e, the slots (or eqivalent points) can augment the psionic cantrip "at higher levels".

In 5E terminology, you might get the ability to put up a defense as a reaction, as a bonus action, or the ability to initiate multiple defenses as an action.
I think it is better to let each psionic cantrip have its own mechanics, whether reaction, bonus, action, or maybe even a permanent feature when choosing the cantrip, whatever mechanics achieves the flavor of the cantrip best.



I will continue commenting on the rest of your system in a future post.
 

Yaarel

🇮🇱He-Mage
Again, the version I ran was an enhanced version of the core rules system, and was evolved on top of the evolution that came from AD&D through 2E and into 3E (and then was an awkward fit but still used to an extent in the very different 4E world).

The rules for psionic combat exist in the 3E (Not Expanded) Psionics Handbook. The rules are, IIRC, right before the Powers listing. They feature a bit of 'This defense works better against that attack', but it is more convoluted than the rules I used. IIRC, the Expanded book eliminated the Psionic Combat and folded the attacks and defenses in as powers - a move that made psionic PCs feel more like another version of a wizard. While my recollection is that we tweaked some of our approach to psionics when the expanded book came out, for the most part we did not build around it as our approach was sufficiently distinct.
So if I understand correctly, the 3e psicombat is a 3.0 thing rather than a 3.5 thing? My 3e group starts with 3.5, so that might explain how I never came across it.

If I can, I might borrow the 3e Psionic Handbook for comparison. You mention its psicombat is convoluted, and you simplified it. Good!

Take it to heart, that 3.5 rejected 3.0 psicombat for reasons. If you want to salvage something from it, "as simple as possible but not simpler", is the way to go.

More than any other edition of D&D, 5e is a democracy. We need to pass the 60% approval rating threshold, in order for any form of psionics to exist at all. Homebrew and DMs Guild will continue, but official 5e support is valuable.


In my systems, the Psychic Warrior remained most inspired by Jedi/Sith concepts, but they had access to a lot of powers that allowed them to modify their attacks, bodies, etc... (mostly psychometabolic, but amongst the other disciplines as well). While your concept would not be "the way" for a psychic warrior under my version of rules, it would be "a way".

Most psychic warriors tended to be able to use their mental abilities to augment their fighting capabilities, allowing them greater mobility (and benefits for using that mobility - for example, there was a power that allowed them to make a single weapon attack that was then applied to every creature that was adjacent to them during their movement - that was a favorite way to clear fodder), battlefield control (telekenisis style effects to move combatants, etc...), deception in combat (for example, a power that made enemies see and believe that a friend and enemy had swapped places), etc...
Star Wars jedi are welcome in my D&D!

Heh, they might be wielding a Rod of Radiance and hopping planes, but they fit in.

However, there were psychic warriors that went in a very different direction. One built himself to be a horror story monster that would convert into a 'death fog', envelop enemies, sap their lifeforce to feed his own PP needs, and then raise their corpses to fight for him. This was achieved through Psychometabloic powers that enlarged him and converted him into gas, Psychokinetic powers that modified life forces (which were delivered as attacks), and Metacreative powers that would fill the husks with Astral Constructs that would wear the bodies like shells. That ended up being the main trick for this PC, but that is how psionics worked compared to spellcasters - fewer tricks, more versatility with each trick.
Yup. All of the above sounds awesome, and feels like the 3e Psywar. I want the 5e Mystic to these kinds of things.

The Psywar has a superhero feel, where the powers that the player chooses for the character concept become a vivid personality that feels archetypal.

Most of these powers are defacto spells. But there is also design space for class features. The ability to "steal" spell slots from an other caster is interesting. It might work as a 5e Mystic class feature or subclass feature.



Regarding nomenclature. I prefer when psionics uses the standard D&D terms like "telekinesis" when appropriate.

Metacreativity is "conjuration". I refer to psychometabolism as "shapeshifting" and it includes healing spells.

In my view, the "Astral Constructs" are actually force constructs, made out of force, like other spells with similar effects, Unseen Servant, Spiritual Weapon, etcetera.

Moreover, I consider force, ethereal ether, and magical energy to all be the same thing (compare Eldritch Blast and force affecting ethereal creatures). Psionicists are minds so the astral plane as a real of thoughts is important. But when psionicists manipulate the material world by means of telekinetic force, they are actually wielding ethereal force. Likewise, the psionic conjurations are made out of force (like other conjurations are).

I honestly like the term "prescient" better, but nevertheless use "divination" for the sake of standard D&D nomenclature.

Psionics is already complex, and to use nonstandard terms redundantly is less helpful for familiarity, gameplay, and popularity.
 

jgsugden

Legend
...Quick question, is it like 1e where a psionic combatant can only attack an other psionic combatant, and unable to affect a nonpsionic target?
No. I did cover that when I discussed how the baseline was that we assumed there were no defenses in place.

Generally speaking, your comments seem to miss the point of the system. For it to have significant value, it can't rely heavily upon the magic system. Cantrips, slots, spell levels, etc... are not just terminology to avoid, but mechanics to avoid. Your suggestions move this system towards a paint job on a wizard, and away from being a distinct system that plays distinctly differently that existing classes while being relatable to fantasy settings.

One important thing to consider when looking athow the puzzle pieces fit together would be the feel we wanted to evoke: Super Heroic figures. The trappings of the super hero are ripe in the way this plays out. Digging in deep to pull off something amazing at great cost? Check. Each hero having their own fairly tightly identified schtick (meaning fewer powers, more depth within each power)? Check. You can see how we looked at comic books, 80s cartoons, and movies to inspire us, from the Wave Motion Gun from Star Blazers inspring how a destructive power might be used to make a single amazing blow that blew out your entire PP reserve and left you helpless to the telepathic battles of Professor X and theShadow King showing back and forth chess matches - you can see how we worked it together into the system.

To understand how it was built: The roots of the system began in AD&D. When 2E came out, we saw how they evolved it and made a few tweaks, but the 2E build formed the new starting foundation. However, when 3E, 3.5, and 4E were released, we used those rules to advise on the evolution of the psionic system, but the core of the 2E design is evident in the rules we used often through the end of 3.5, and sporadically since then.

We had levels for psionic powers for a bit, but then we dropped them back out in favor of having each power be scalable within itself. We alternated between simplifying PP use to make it easier to understand to adding complexity to PP use to make it more powerful. We merged powers, added new powers and generally played around with everything. We built intricate designs for some powers that we realized we could simplify, and struggled to make other powers work as we wanted them without pages of text to spell out the corner cases.

However, in the end, and throughout the evolution, people liked the system. They played the PCs. They enjoyed them. They worked. It wasn't perfect, but it was good. Would it hold up to 5E design standards without modification? No. We did not fully work it into 4E because that was such a right turn, and I've been waiting for an official 5E psionics to try to settle upon a best course, but there are a lot of balance design decisions in 5E that would require a modern full implementation of my system to adjust, especially in terms of breadth of abilities available. They narrowed that space for spellcasters in 5E. and keeping this system distinct means we can't end up with similar breath of abilities, but at the same time we can't narrow them too much without depriving them of versatility.
 

jgsugden

Legend
...Regarding nomenclature. I prefer when psionics uses the standard D&D terms like "telekinesis" when appropriate.

Metacreativity is "conjuration". I refer to psychometabolism as "shapeshifting" and it includes healing spells.

In my view, the "Astral Constructs" are actually force constructs, made out of force, like other spells with similar effects, Unseen Servant, Spiritual Weapon, etcetera.

Moreover, I consider force, ethereal ether, and magical energy to all be the same thing (compare Eldritch Blast and force affecting ethereal creatures). Psionicists are minds so the astral plane as a real of thoughts is important. But when psionicists manipulate the material world by means of telekinetic force, they are actually wielding ethereal force. Likewise, the psionic conjurations are made out of force (like other conjurations are).

I honestly like the term "prescient" better, but nevertheless use "divination" for the sake of standard D&D nomenclature.

Psionics is already complex, and to use nonstandard terms redundantly is less helpful for familiarity, gameplay, and popularity.
I am going to reiterate: You're thinking of this differently than we did, and it is resulting in you missing a key point. Psionics should not be a paint job on magic. This was the core reason we diverged more and more from 3E designs - because they moved towards making it 'alternate magic' while we held true to it as distinct design space unique to psionics.

If metacreativity is conjuration, you don't have a good system that has meaningful design space.

From our persepctive, metacreativity has distinct elements and core approaches that differ from conjuration magic in fundamental ways. You can absolutely draw parallels to some elements of metacreativity and conjuration, but they do not feel the same, especially when the player and DM embrace the dynamic differences. Mechanically, stylistically, and lore wise - Metacreativity is different. As it was added in the 3E era, our designs of the Metacreative powers tend to be evolved considerably from the books. For example, you can steal aspects from targets nearby to augment your Astral Constructs if you have lingering powers impacting those nearby.

For example, when you make an astral construct, it comes from you. Not from the weave, or a god, or some other external source.
 

James Gasik

We don't talk about Pun-Pun
Wait, is that a change based on your system? Because Astral Constructs are formed from stuff from the Astral Plane (hence their name).
 

Yaarel

🇮🇱He-Mage
Generally speaking, your comments seem to miss the point of the system. For it to have significant value, it can't rely heavily upon the magic system. Cantrips, slots, spell levels, etc... are not just terminology to avoid, but mechanics to avoid. Your suggestions move this system towards a paint job on a wizard, and away from being a distinct system that plays distinctly differently that existing classes while being relatable to fantasy settings.
I love the 3e Psion. 3e Psionics is spellcasting. I want the 5e Psion to cast Wish, Foresight, Shapechange, (psychic healer psychometabolic) Heal, and other thematically appropriate spells at appropriate levels. If the spells are missing a psionic effect, create a new spell to cover it.

3e psionics plays the same as the Wizard and other spellcasters. The mechanical difference is spontaneous spells instead of prepared spells. In 5e all spells are spontaneous, so there is no difference.

For the 5e Psion class, I want spells, plain and simple.

The 3e Psywar is also a spellcaster.

If the 5e Psion full spellcaster is secure, I am more willing to experiment with the nonspells of the 5e Mystic class (aka Psywar).



One important thing to consider when looking athow the puzzle pieces fit together would be the feel we wanted to evoke: Super Heroic figures. The trappings of the super hero are ripe in the way this plays out.
The superhero systems that I am familiar with, use defacto spells. The player goes thru a list of spells, and chooses which ones the want for their character concept. Flight is a spell. Laser beam eyes is a spell. Impervious force armor is a spell. And so on. Many are at-will cantrips. Maybe it might even be a higher level spell that require a spell slot to be permanently dedicated to it for a permanent effect.

Digging in deep to pull off something amazing at great cost? Check.
5e mechanics, has a superhero concept use a higher spell slot to represent the feel of reaching deep for more power.

Each hero having their own fairly tightly identified schtick (meaning fewer powers, more depth within each power)? Check.
A tight list of known spells is like a 5e Sorcerer.

You can see how we looked at comic books, 80s cartoons, and movies to inspire us, from the Wave Motion Gun from Star Blazers inspring how a destructive power might be used to make a single amazing blow that blew out your entire PP reserve and left you helpless
These "nova" concepts tend to be wildly gamebreaking, mechanically. The proverbial I win button.

Crazy overpowered possibilities exist in earlier editions, but each later edition systematically removes them for good reason

to the telepathic battles of Professor X and theShadow King showing back and forth chess matches - you can see how we worked it together into the system.
These superhero powers are long range spells. Some spells can effect anywhere in the same plane. Some spells might affect any plane.

Some of these superhero concepts are more like outofbody projection. Two spellcasters meet each other outofbody in the astral plane or in the ethereal plane for a duel. Outofbody might be an excellent spell.

To understand how it was built: The roots of the system began in AD&D. When 2E came out, we saw how they evolved it and made a few tweaks, but the 2E build formed the new starting foundation.
3e rejected 2e psionics. To salvage anything from 2e, the 5e version of it must pass the 60% approval threshold.

This 60% threshold is the reality that all psi fans face.

Any one-true-wayism will fail.

The Mystic class is a design space to tinker with the 2e nonspell mechanics.

However, when 3E, 3.5, and 4E were released, we used those rules to advise on the evolution of the psionic system, but the core of the 2E design is evident in the rules we used often through the end of 3.5, and sporadically since then.
You continued to use 2e in your homebrews for later editions, but the later editions mainly discontinued it.

60% approval threshold.

We had levels for psionic powers for a bit, but then we dropped them back out in favor of having each power be scalable within itself.
A cantrip can use higher level slots for thematically related effects that belong at higher levels.

I want a "Psychokinesis" cantrip to work like this, using higher slots for bigger targets (targeting the size of objects rather than the weight since guessing weight is often problematic).

We alternated between simplifying PP use to make it easier to understand to adding complexity to PP use to make it more powerful. We merged powers, added new powers and generally played around with everything.
Write spells that offer versatile effects.

We built intricate designs for some powers that we realized we could simplify, and struggled to make other powers work as we wanted them without pages of text to spell out the corner cases.
The simpler the mechanic is, the better.

However, in the end, and throughout the evolution, people liked the system. They played the PCs. They enjoyed them. They worked. It wasn't perfect, but it was good. Would it hold up to 5E design standards without modification? No.
Yes. Even Wish could be a cantrip that starts something like Prestidigitation, and uses higher slots upto Wish.

We did not fully work it into 4E because that was such a right turn,
4e is the first edition to systematically balance mechanics. The advancement schedule seems too inflexible. But 4e has its merits.

For players accustomed to broken mechanics in 3e, 4e was a shock.

and I've been waiting for an official 5E psionics to try to settle upon a best course, but there are a lot of balance design decisions in 5E that would require a modern full implementation of my system to adjust, especially in terms of breadth of abilities available. They narrowed that space for spellcasters in 5E. and keeping this system distinct means we can't end up with similar breath of abilities, but at the same time we can't narrow them too much without depriving them of versatility.
By having two psionic classes, there is design space for both a 5e Psion spellcaster and a 5e Mystic noncaster.
 

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