Paul Farquhar
Legend
That would be kind of like asking a white American to fix a setting called Yankidoodaland.
D&D General What About Those Other D&D Settings?
- Thread starter Dragonhelm
- Start date
humble minion
Legend
Here's a couple of Arabian (I believe Qatari, or possibly Yemeni?) gamers doing a read-through of Al-Qadim with an eye on fixing it. They're young, and this is their first sight of the material (or else I suspect they wouldn't have covered the two books in the Land of Fate setting in the wrong order!), but their take is fairly nuanced, and from the videos I've watched so far, they don't believe the setting is unsalvageable.
And here's the game that they ran in the fixed setting.
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humble minion
Legend
What makes you think WotC want to buy setting IP? They release 4-5 books a year and at most 2 of those are setting books. Between the legacy D&D material and all the MtG worlds, they've got more IP than they know what to do with already. And if WotC want to release an Asian-themed setting in the 2020s, it sure as hell won't be Rokugan, which is an American-written theme-park mish-mash of Chinese and Japanese already. They'll call on some of the contributors to Radiant Citadel and either get them to design something new and more authentic, or else adapt an MtG setting.
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LuisCarlos17f
Legend
My opinion is Hasbro wants to become an entertaiment empire, and they need multimedia franchises. They aren't so interested into to publish more sourcebooks, but different types of merchandising products: movies, cartoons, toys, videogames, novels, comics. A merger with Embracer Group or Paradox Interactive shouldn't be totally impossible.
humble minion
Legend
I think the last year or so of Hasbro's decisionmaking has proven this incorrect fairly thoroughly. They're focusing much more on monetising what they already have, whether it's by releasing MtG material at a higher rate, expanding D&D Beyond into a VTT that they'll no doubt stick a massive pricetag on to, or their abortive attempt to tax the entire D&D 3pp ecosystem ruinously for the privilege of existing.
If they wanted to expand wildly into spin-off products, we'd have seen them by now. Between D&D and MtG they have a massive mountain of IP, if they wanted to spin off multimedia product lines, they don't need to buy more. Remember the reason WotC is so profitable for Hasbro (and is keeping Hasbro's balance sheet in the black right now) is because their products are largely just printed material, and therefore cheap to make. Video games, toys etc are much more expensive to make and so either have much lower profit margins in the case of toys, or much higher risk of huge monetary losses in the case of games. And novels? Other than Weis and Hickman's new Dragonlance trilogy, and whatever it is that Drizzt is doing these days, WotC deliberately and consciously shut down the D&D novel line years ago, and after the PR disaster that was War of the Spark, they cancelled the MtG novel line only a few years ago. WotC is very clearly moving away from publishing novels, not towards it. I mean, if WotC were in the multimedia business then we’d have seen all sorts of tie-in products for the movie - miniatures, a sourcebook themed around locations from the movie, a movie-branded starter set, etc etc - but there’s been almost nothing. It WotC are trying to move into the multimedia franchise space, they seem to be missing a lot of opportunities.
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havard
Adventurer
WotC owns the rights to everything that matters in order to publish new Blackmoor material.
Older settings are often seen as generic because everything that came later borrowed their main features from them. I think it would be possible to make them feel distinct again, but I would do it through art, layout and presentation.
But fantasy has evolved today into something very different than fantasy was in 1970. That is something that could be leaned into in order to highlight those features. Or you could also lean into the concept of "Feudal Knights uncover crashed spaceship while under attack by Vikings". In any case, if you want to make it awesome, you can.
-Havard
Micah Sweet
Level Up & OSR Enthusiast
I think that's the best thing for them too, but WotC seems unwilling to make a wholly new setting on their own.
LuisCarlos17f
Legend
The old settings for the new generations are too "generic". We are talking about a fandom too used to lots of fantasy MMOs. Even a famous franchise as Blizzard's Diablo suffers the end of its old days of glory. At least Dark Sun could mark the difference.
WotC is not so interested into to sell a product for nostalgic collectors, but to attract new players/consumers. The settings what return should offer something Forgotten Realms couldn't.
Hollow World could become a generic spin-off, not only in Mystara, but "inmortals" creating demiplanes in other wildspaces.
I guess WotC doesn't want to create a new setting because now they are too busy with the "update". A new setting would need enough space to add all the new elements.
WotC is not so interested into to sell a product for nostalgic collectors, but to attract new players/consumers. The settings what return should offer something Forgotten Realms couldn't.
Hollow World could become a generic spin-off, not only in Mystara, but "inmortals" creating demiplanes in other wildspaces.
I guess WotC doesn't want to create a new setting because now they are too busy with the "update". A new setting would need enough space to add all the new elements.
The Glen
Legend
Mystara is quite popular outside the US because it was the first setting translated into other languages. If you wanted to play D&D in Japan you had Mystara or nothing. The allegory for real-world cultures as fantasy nations gave it an appeal that other generic fantasy settings didn't have. You would market it as the D&D setting that represented other cultures, so the Japanese, Italians, Polynesians, Indians, Arabs, Scandinavians, Slavs, Mongolians, Cherokee, Irish, Egyptians, Argentinians, Spanish, Babylonians and Texans all have something they can relate to.
Honestly, I don't think 5e has detailed any of the campaign settings to the extent of previous editions. Still no campaign guide or boxed set for Forgotten Realms. One adventure set in Dragonlance. One adventure in Ravenloft and an underwhelming book light on detail. A pretty good Eberron book, then nothing.
I'm not a fan of MtG, so maybe those are better - I haven't looked at them. But Paizo's Lost Omen guides blow WotC's out of the water, as did the old boxed sets from the TSR era.
I'm not a fan of MtG, so maybe those are better - I haven't looked at them. But Paizo's Lost Omen guides blow WotC's out of the water, as did the old boxed sets from the TSR era.
havard
Adventurer
Look at the most successful fan franchise today: The Marvel Cinematic Universe.
Did they stop using Iron Man because some of his stories were seen as "problematic"? Did they stop using Captain America because he was seen as too generic and old fashioned? Did they decide never to use Man Thing or Ego The Living Planet because they were too obscure?
The D&D worlds are WotC's Marvel Characters. Potentially they could generate tons of wealth for the company. They could create separate "skins" on DNDBeyond depending on which setting you are using. Treat them as Harry Potter Houses or Team Jacob vs. Team vs. Team Edward from Twilight.
If they were smart, they would bring every setting back. But they have to make them good. At this point, how many people work as permanent D&D staff?
bedir than
Hero
I think this misunderstands the modern player. They aren't looking for the dictat from WotC to tell them how their table and world should be.
They are playing original characters in original worlds, because it's the play at their table that matters - not Ed Greenwood or Keith Baker or Jeff Grubb
They're also likely running homebrew adventures that research says last a couple months, yet we still get massive levels 1-13 campaign adventures.
D&D fans buy a lot of stuff, even when they don't play it.
Clint_L
Hero
Whatever they do for Greyhawk, I want there to be a deluxe edition that comes with lots of historical material. Maybe hire Jon Peterson (Game Wizards) to write a condensed history of how the game started, emphasizing the importance of Greyhawk and Blackmoore (which should be included as an adventure setting) in the creation and evolution of D&D. Really give Arneson, Gygax and friends their flowers, and keep that story alive for new generations of players.
I think that kind of deluxe edition would sell well, but I also think it is important to pass those roots on. D&D isn't just a game, it's a culture. The 50th needs to celebrate it as such.
I think that kind of deluxe edition would sell well, but I also think it is important to pass those roots on. D&D isn't just a game, it's a culture. The 50th needs to celebrate it as such.
Paul Farquhar
Legend
There actually isn't actually that much Blackmoor material published though. Most of the setting is just inferred from a handful of adventures. It's similar to Netir Vale, the Radiant Citadel settings, and Arcavios in that respect.WotC owns the rights to everything that matters in order to publish new Blackmoor material.
Older settings are often seen as generic because everything that came later borrowed their main features from them. I think it would be possible to make them feel distinct again, but I would do it through art, layout and presentation.
But fantasy has evolved today into something very different than fantasy was in 1970. That is something that could be leaned into in order to highlight those features. Or you could also lean into the concept of "Feudal Knights uncover crashed spaceship while under attack by Vikings". In any case, if you want to make it awesome, you can.
-Havard
Not that that is a bad thing, any of those could be expanded upon.
overgeeked
B/X Known World
Since it's officially part of the Forgotten Realms it's already open on the DM's Guild and has already had several sourcebooks made for it.
The Asians Represent Podcast did a read through.
Some of the people from those videos were involved in a rework of the setting that's up on DM's Guild.
Campaign Guide: Zakhara - Adventures in the Land of Fate (Al-Qadim and Forgotten Realms Sourcebook) - Dungeon Masters Guild | Dungeon Masters Guild
Campaign Guide: Zakhara - Adventures in the Land of Fate (Al-Qadim and Forgotten Realms Sourcebook) - "Don't miss the Campaign Guide to Zakhara! Bringing the setting to 5e and cleaning up many of the cultural issues!" -
havard
Adventurer
What you are saying has nothing to do with modern players. Players and DMs have been doing this for 50 years.
But this isn't about what they want. This is about what WotC can do that will make them money. And if teenagers today are wearing t-shirts of Metallica and ACDC, I see no reason why they wouldn't wear a T-shirt with Dark Sun or Dragonlance.
These are powerful brands that WotC could make a lot of money off if they knew how to do it.
I mean they are making toys off the old D&D Cartoon so there is that...
Absolutely.
And older fans? Remember, these are the fans who have the money. Don't discard them either. The surveys might be useful to WotC, but the vast majority of D&D fans don't respond to surveys. What is new about D&D fans today is that it is a larger group than it ever was before, with a wide range of preferences.
People don't like setting info? Look at the popularity of Lore videos on youtube and other platforms.
Older fans can also be used for free marketing. Sure, many complain if they deliver a bad product. But maybe WotC just needs to up their game when it comes to what they are delivering.
-Havard
havard
Adventurer
Perhaps, but if you look at the four modules that TSR put out, they contain information that is enough for at least 8 WotC style Hard Cover books.
If they really wanted to, they could probably buy the rights to the ZGG d20 Blackmoor line. If they wanted to.
What Blackmoor has is name recognition and history.
Should they make a 50 year anniversary of Castle Blackmoor? As a colletor item, I think it would make them a lot of money.
-Havard
