D&D General What it means for a race to end up in the PHB, its has huge significance

[Paul Farquhar]

Your argument against holding a shield while spellcasting is overstated.


Spell components are broken.

5e is already in the process of fixing the problem of spell components, such as Psionic eliminating them, other innate magic ignoring them, and Wands replacing them. 2024 needs to let the spell components in each spell itself rest in peace. It is the class and subclass that must do the heavy lifting with regard to how spells cast. Each class has its own components and requirements and flavor.

Your opinion is your opinion.

 

[Yaarel]

Your opinion is your opinion.

And 5e mechanics is already eliminating the need for a spell to have spell components.

The spells with components are undesirable and interfere with other class and species concepts. For example, a Dance Bard shouldnt be messing around with Verbal or Material. Here Somatic is the flavor. For every spell.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

And 5e mechanics is already eliminating the need for a spell to have spell components.

The spells with components are undesirable and interfere with other class and species concepts. For example, a Dance Bard shouldnt be messing around with Verbal or Material. Here Somatic is the flavor. For every spell.

Again your opinion. Any dance bards show up in my game an anvil will drop on them from a great height. Meanwhile, other bards can use an instrument, or components, but they must have a hand free to do it. I like components as they are.

And psionics is magic. I requires the same stuff as all other magic.

 

[Mecheon]

And psionics is magic. I requires the same stuff as all other magic.

Psionics isn't arcane magic or divine magic, though. Illithids don't go digging around in pouches for components regardless, they just mind blast you

 

[Hussar]

Psionics isn't arcane magic or divine magic, though. Illithids don't go digging around in pouches for components regardless, they just mind blast you

And not every spell requires a component.

But, psionic spells, in the rules, do. @Yaarel is mistaken that 5e is somehow removing spell components from the game.

 

[Hussar]

But on the point about mechanics matter.

To me, species should largely go the same route as alignment. After all, while alignment has zero mechanical impact in 5e, it does have a significant impact on play. Someone playing a LG fighter is going to play that character differently than a CE fighter, despite alignment having no actual mechanics.

And the trajectory for species does seem to be following alignment. In early D&D, alignment had HUGE amounts of impact. Your choice of alignment affected what classes you could play, how spells interacted with you and gave your DM a honking big lever into controlling the behavior of your character (the rules for changing alignment were punishing). Then, later down the line, alignment becomes far less restrictive. Most classes remove alignment restrictions, changing alignment has little impact on your character and spells and magical effects key less and less off of alignment.

Now we have 5e. Alignment has zero mechanical weight. None. There is virtually nothing in the game that keys off alignment. Yet it still has an impact on play. We talk about demons and devils being evil. The party is typically presumed to be good aligned - at least the core books assume that. And players do take alignment into consideration when playing their characters.

I would argue that species is very similar. The mechanical impact of species is very minor. Based solely on mechanics, no descriptions, nothing else, it would be very hard to tell an elf from a human from a half elf. After all, cantrips are hardly species specific. Lots of classes have cantrips. A human wizard, an elf wizard and a half-elf wizard, stripped of flavor, only using mechanics, would be pretty hard to distinguish from each other. Not impossible, that's true. But, not easy.

But flavor wise? VERY different. They should be. They should play and look very different at the table. And, typically, they do (although I've seen an awful lot of "humans that see in the dark elves" which always grinds my gears). Not because of the mechanics, but, like alignment, because of the flavor surrounding the species.

 

[Henadic Theologian]

I expect that most players will assume they are available to them. However, races being in the PHB has no bearing on which PC races I allow in a campaign.

You are the exception, not the rule I believe.

 

[Parmandur]

But on the point about mechanics matter.

To me, species should largely go the same route as alignment. After all, while alignment has zero mechanical impact in 5e, it does have a significant impact on play. Someone playing a LG fighter is going to play that character differently than a CE fighter, despite alignment having no actual mechanics.

And the trajectory for species does seem to be following alignment. In early D&D, alignment had HUGE amounts of impact. Your choice of alignment affected what classes you could play, how spells interacted with you and gave your DM a honking big lever into controlling the behavior of your character (the rules for changing alignment were punishing). Then, later down the line, alignment becomes far less restrictive. Most classes remove alignment restrictions, changing alignment has little impact on your character and spells and magical effects key less and less off of alignment.

Now we have 5e. Alignment has zero mechanical weight. None. There is virtually nothing in the game that keys off alignment. Yet it still has an impact on play. We talk about demons and devils being evil. The party is typically presumed to be good aligned - at least the core books assume that. And players do take alignment into consideration when playing their characters.

I would argue that species is very similar. The mechanical impact of species is very minor. Based solely on mechanics, no descriptions, nothing else, it would be very hard to tell an elf from a human from a half elf. After all, cantrips are hardly species specific. Lots of classes have cantrips. A human wizard, an elf wizard and a half-elf wizard, stripped of flavor, only using mechanics, would be pretty hard to distinguish from each other. Not impossible, that's true. But, not easy.

But flavor wise? VERY different. They should be. They should play and look very different at the table. And, typically, they do (although I've seen an awful lot of "humans that see in the dark elves" which always grinds my gears). Not because of the mechanics, but, like alignment, because of the flavor surrounding the species.

I think the main value Alignment has is as a shorthand for DM prep and improv: knowing that rhe Vizier is Neutral Good, Neutral Evil, or Lawdul Neutral is helpful when improvising a response to player actions.

 

[Henadic Theologian]

Does anyone else think there are yet more unannounced races like Gobliniods or Genasi, or Gith?

 

[jmartkdr2]

I think the main value Alignment has is as a shorthand for DM prep and improv: knowing that rhe Vizier is Neutral Good, Neutral Evil, or Lawdul Neutral is helpful when improvising a response to player actions.

Even if they went to fully non-mechanical races, they'd still be that: dwarves are gruff, elves are posh, gnomes are obsessive, etc.