D&D 5E What to do with DM issues?

Uchawi

First Post
Decide if DM fiat and ad hoc rulings will ruin your fun, and if so, find another game. I guess you can discuss it, but that is a piece of thin ice depending on how the DM takes criticism or suggestions.

Sometimes the player is more knowledgeable on specific rules versus the DM, but sometimes the DM does changes things on intent. I am ok with that as long as the DM has done it ahead of time, versus doing it on the fly or adjusting to good player strategy or tactics; because the encounter is a cake walk. Determining if that is the case is anyone's guess.
 

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pukunui

Legend
Now I didn't know about the limit until afterwards when I checked out what we just fought.
I think it's worth pointing out that some DMs would consider this cheating. Players shouldn't be "checking out" monster stats in the MM. In fact, some DMs deliberately change monster stats for this very reason - that is, so players who *do* read the MM (maybe because they also DM) can still be surprised from time to time.

As others have said, unless it seems like the DM is deliberately giving his monsters an unfair advantage, I wouldn't worry about it.
 

Celtavian

Dragon Lord
I don't worry about it. I find a way to win. The DM may have modified the monster. A player forcing a DM to give away any modifications he made to a monster isn't good table etiquette.
 

Gillywonka

First Post
Well, it doesn't hurt to politely ask i guess, but your PC shouldn't know monster stats, no metagaming! In the campaign i run, I had several level 4 kobold barbarians attack the party, (party is at level 5) and it really caught them off guard. They did ask me, "aren't these kobolds a little tough?"
My reply was "You tell me, but what are you doing?"

It was different and everyone had fun.
 


Psikerlord#

Explorer
Publisher
I think it's worth pointing out that some DMs would consider this cheating. Players shouldn't be "checking out" monster stats in the MM. In fact, some DMs deliberately change monster stats for this very reason - that is, so players who *do* read the MM (maybe because they also DM) can still be surprised from time to time.

As others have said, unless it seems like the DM is deliberately giving his monsters an unfair advantage, I wouldn't worry about it.

I change pretty much every monster I use. Sometimes I weaken them, sometimes I make them stronger. I make changes before the fight and on occasion even mid-fight. I roll every monster HP too (using a quick dice app). Players should consider the MM as a guide only. Your actual monster in game could be wildly different (or indeed not in the MM at all!).

The DM's main job is to try and make the game fun. Ime tweaking monsters often produces more fun.
 

S

Sunseeker

Guest
Then you should probably stay out of the Monster Manual if you are not planning on running a game.

Oh come on posts like these are just absolute garbage.

1: The Druid can utilize a number of forms from the MM (elementals and dinosaurs are not mentioned in the PHB), so druid players at least need to read the MM.
2: The Wizard, Warlock and anyone who takes the Find Familiar spell have options available to them from the MM.
3: The MM contains some downright cool stuff and is worth checking out.
4: What better way to want to run a game than to find a creature in the MM and think "wouldn't it be really cool if we fought this thing!?"
5: A DM may set the rules for the table, but they have no right to tell you what to do with your free time, and any DM who thinks they have that right is a horrible DM, yes I went there.
6: Unless the player becomes a jerk about what they've read, then really it's none of the DMs business what they read or think they know.

If a player has trouble separating in-game and out-of-game knowledge, it's fine to address THAT. But reading additional material beyond the PHB is only a sin at tables run by tyrants.
 

Tony Vargas

Legend
Oh come on posts like these are just absolute garbage.

1: The Druid can utilize a number of forms from the MM (elementals and dinosaurs are not mentioned in the PHB), so druid players at least need to read the MM.
2: The Wizard, Warlock and anyone who takes the Find Familiar spell have options available to them from the MM.
Doesn't mean they need to see the stats.

5: A DM may set the rules for the table, but they have no right to tell you what to do with your free time, and any DM who thinks they have that right is a horrible DM, yes I went there.
I don't blame you. ;)

5e doesn't take it as far as 1e did: there's no advice that the DM actively keep his players in the dark about the rules. But, there's also not a lot of point to a player arming himself with data from the MM or DMG - or even PH, when you get right down to it - everything is in the DM's bailiwick. Anything might be changed. You'll know when you declare an action or ask a question, and you won't really gain anything for spotting the 'change.'

3: The MM contains some downright cool stuff and is worth checking out.
4: What better way to want to run a game than to find a creature in the MM and think "wouldn't it be really cool if we fought this thing!?"
6: Unless the player becomes a jerk about what they've read, then really it's none of the DMs business what they read or think they know.

If a player has trouble separating in-game and out-of-game knowledge, it's fine to address THAT. But reading additional material beyond the PHB is only a sin at tables run by tyrants.
Nod. And, of course, DMs would like to play once in a while, and have presumably become quite familiar with a lot of monsters. You can't require ignorance. But, you can expect rulings to go unquestioned, even by knowledgeable players, and for those players to keep any comments about what they suspect polite, constructive, and not bring the up when they might disrupt the game.

Not worrying about them at all is really the best option. Trust your DM, have fun.
 

77IM

Explorer!!!
Supporter
Frankly, when I am the DM, I LOVE it when players point out my mistakes. I've got a lot on my mind -- keeping track of the whole world-state, AND the internal mental state of the NPCs, and running combat, etc. -- and sometimes I forget about something or get a monster stat mixed up or misread a spell. So if I goof up the range on some eye-beams and someone points it out (politely), I'll be like, "Oh snap, you are right. Well he'll fly back down next round, and here, have some Inspiration for your troubles."
 

Henry

Autoexreginated
I think it's worth pointing out that some DMs would consider this cheating. Players shouldn't be "checking out" monster stats in the MM. In fact, some DMs deliberately change monster stats for this very reason - that is, so players who *do* read the MM (maybe because they also DM) can still be surprised from time to time.

As others have said, unless it seems like the DM is deliberately giving his monsters an unfair advantage, I wouldn't worry about it.

I wouldn't consider it cheating, because I'm a DM in a group full of DMs, and always encourage others to DM if they haven't tried it before.

That said, I'm with AriochQ and Sacrosanct, et. al. I fully agree with DM as final arbiter, but am on board with bringing up a rules question after the session, and if a DM intentionally changed something, so be it. I'm guilty myself of occasionally slipping up and rules lawyering during a session, but I recognize it as a vice rather than a virtue. If I catch myself doing it, I'm quick to back the DM's play and resume game time though.
 

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