What's the Deal with Staves?

[Evilhalfling]

Okay So I created a staff price calculator in Excel then I ran some staves from DMG
charming calc=listed price
swarming insects calculated 21k listed 24k
defense calc = list
frost calc 60600, list 56250
Healing Calc 37575, list 27,750
Life Calc 73122, list 155,750 - material component issues
just to check
Fire calc 28500, list 17750

It seems pretty random.

I also ran staves from the planar handbook they were all half the calculated price, so they were aparently built using 375xslvlxclvl to calculate price.
The Draconomicon uses full price and list matches the calc in both staves

 

[Nail]

The "having words" was in regards to a player trying to min/max the staff by having a high-level spell that they don't plan on using that takes 50 charges. So, say I want a staff of Fireball (1 charge). Normally, it would be 3*5*750=11250.

Now, consider this staff: Wall of Fire (50 charges), Fire Shield (50 charges), Fireball (1 charge): 4*7*750/50+4*7*750*.75/50+3*7*750*.5=8610 gold. I just saved myself 3000 gold by ADDING spells to the staff.

Ah.

So, if you instead follow the rules that say "order by cost", your problem disappears.

Sounds like an excellent arguement to ORDER BY PRICE, NOT SPELL LEVEL.

 

[Nail]

Okay So I created a staff price calculator in Excel then I ran some staves from DMG
charming calc=listed price
swarming insects calculated 21k listed 24k
defense calc = list
frost calc 60600, list 56250
Healing Calc 37575, list 27,750
Life Calc 73122, list 155,750 - material component issues
just to check
Fire calc 28500, list 17750

It seems pretty random.

I also ran staves from the planar handbook they were all half the calculated price, so they were aparently built using 375xslvlxclvl to calculate price.
The Draconomicon uses full price and list matches the calc in both staves

Thanks, Evilhalfling! I was just wondering what the distribution was.

Seems as if they should have stuck to their original formulas. They make more sense, and are quite usable.

 

[calypso15]

Ah.

So, if you instead follow the rules that say "order by cost", your problem disappears.

Sounds like an excellent arguement to ORDER BY PRICE, NOT SPELL LEVEL.

I never said you shouldn't. I was just pointing out what the rules said. In all honesty, with the exception of scrolls/potions/wands, I price anything my players want to make. They give me what they want the item to be, and I give them the price that they can get it for, if at all.

Calypso

 

[Nail]

I was just pointing out what the rules said.

But the rules only say that in a minor area - an area, frankly, that looks like an error or "shorthand". They say "order by cost" everywhere else.

Why are you making this so difficult for yourself?

 

[calypso15]

But the rules only say that in a minor area. They say "order by cost" everywhere else.

Why are you making this so difficult for yourself?

Because the "minor area" where it is said is under "Creating Staffs". I don't care what it says anywhere else. That, and I'm a stubborn SOB, just like most of the people on this board.

Calypso

 

[Bad Paper]

I also ran staves from the planar handbook they were all half the calculated price, so they were aparently built using 375xslvlxclvl to calculate price.

There is a staff in a WotC adventure SPOILER: the Standing Stonethat is priced this way (incorrectly). When I fixed the value I was really happy there were only a third of the charges left! Pricey!

 

[Nail]

That, and I'm a stubborn SOB, just like most of the people on this board.

Point.

That whole section of the DMG explaining "cost" while they're explaining "market price", and "base price" is just asking for misinterpretation (and sloppy writing by multiple editors). Ugg.

 

[Nail]

BTW: Did Plane Sailing get the point that his PC got a Staff of Fire at a steep discount?

Again: Way to go, Plane Sailing!

 

[Nail]

BTW: I just looked over the XP records of one of the groups I DM. It looks as if, on average, the PCs advance 1 level every 5 sessions. And we have about 2 - 3 encounters per session, so that works out to about 12 encounters per level.

(My encounters tend to be tough, and the ELs are almost always slightly above the APL. The PCs are now 10th level.)