What's your favorite super hero RPG?
I have one word for people who complain about the math in champions... Spreadsheets.
If you're posting or reading messages on these boards, you obviously have a computer and that means you probably have a spreadsheet program. Just set it up to do the math for you. It isn't that complicated and boy does it make it easier to tweak your character.
It's far easier to create a spreadsheet to do champions characters than it is do one for a D&D character and there are certainly enough of those out there.
Hell half my D&D group games with laptops in front of them and I keep my char on a spreadsheet.
But hands down, no questions asked for anything short of omnipotent gods, Champions beats the snot out of any of the other superhero games out there.
If you're posting or reading messages on these boards, you obviously have a computer and that means you probably have a spreadsheet program. Just set it up to do the math for you. It isn't that complicated and boy does it make it easier to tweak your character.
It's far easier to create a spreadsheet to do champions characters than it is do one for a D&D character and there are certainly enough of those out there.
Hell half my D&D group games with laptops in front of them and I keep my char on a spreadsheet.
But hands down, no questions asked for anything short of omnipotent gods, Champions beats the snot out of any of the other superhero games out there.
drowdude
First Post
I prefer the old Marvel Super Heroes game (not that crappy Saga-system game). It is fast-paced and easy to modify on the fly. You could easily work something up to reflect just about any power you could imagine.
Ive played Heroes Unlimited and Champions as well.
HU is kewl as an add-on to Rifts but not that great as a stand-alone RPG.
And Champions suxxxxxxxxx IMO, nothing against those who play it or anything, it's just not for me.... WAAAAAAY too freaking dicey to be fun... and dont even get me started on the soliloquy rule
Ive played Heroes Unlimited and Champions as well.
HU is kewl as an add-on to Rifts but not that great as a stand-alone RPG.
And Champions suxxxxxxxxx IMO, nothing against those who play it or anything, it's just not for me.... WAAAAAAY too freaking dicey to be fun... and dont even get me started on the soliloquy rule
Tratyn Runewind
First Post
Hello!
Here are a few superhero games I've played, and some general impressions of them:
Hope these help!
Here are a few superhero games I've played, and some general impressions of them:
- Champions - Chalk up another vote for Champions as the best of the lot, for sheer flexibility and ability to capture the "feel" of the superhero genre with a minimum of fuss. I've never had any problems with the pace of combat, but then, most complaints I've heard about that seem to center on the Speed chart (supposedly eliminated in the Fuzion version), which was simplicity itself for the Star Fleet Battles players of my little group ...
- GURPS Supers - It can be done, and can be a lot of fun. However, if you have a copy of Champions, there's little reason to bother. Too many of the rules from GURPS Supers itself seem poorly thought out, poorly adapted to the GURPS system, and/or outright unbalanced. The multi-genre nature of superhero gaming means that too many useful rules are scattered around other GURPS products (Martial Arts, Psionics, the magic supplements, etc.). GURPS' realistic defaults can require a lot of tweaking and optional rules to get properly adjusted to the superhero genre, sometimes to the point where it hardly seems like you're playing GURPS anymore anyway. And my opinion of the default campaign world pretty much echoes those of Psion and Green Knight.
- DC Heroes - There was a nice symmetry to the 9-stat system; an attack accuracy, attack power, and defense power stat in physical, mental, and magical categories. However, the exponential nature of the stats, while perhaps convenient in representing the vast range of power found in the DC universe, seemed mostly to unnecessarily complicate what should have been simple calculations (and this is from someone who actually likes Champions and GURPS Vehicles). Still, I have a soft spot reserved in my heart for any system whose basic set (in its 2nd Edition) included the stats for Guy Gardner at his peak (i. e., with Sinestro's ring)...
- Marvel SAGA - The way the system used cards for randomization seemed a VERY nice fit for the superhero genre. However, the way each stat represented both the stat itself and skill at using it was nonsensical, and resulted in one of the most irritating kludges I've seen in a game, to keep "bricks" from routinely squashing DEX-fighters into paste. Still, generally a nice improvement over earlier TSR Marvel efforts, in terms of system mechanics.
- Marvel Super Heroes - bad on many levels, but not unplayably bad unless you tried to use its random character generation methods. Apparently targeted towards 9-year-olds, it did have some decent modules, and nice support in the form of the "Gamer's Handbook of the Marvel Universe". More than adequate for quick, mindless, fun fights with favorite Marvel characters on one of the module maps while waiting for straggling players to arrive for the regularly scheduled game of something else.
Hope these help!
Black Omega
First Post
I've played other systems but for me it's all Champions. I can put together characters on the fly given a few minutes, but that's something that can come with years playing the system.
Champions does a great job of simulating the genre. It's generic like Gurps but more cinematic than realistic. I still routinely come up with characters ideas for 3rded DnD that I can't do in the system because I still think in Hero System terms.
Combat can go pretty fast is people are prepared. Pretty slow if they are inexperienced or unprepared. Someone gave the example of a 75pt power pool and asked how many points the powers were and how much end they cost. I've used power pools alot of times, all you need to do is have a set sheet of powers you use together. It might take a half hour to an hour to create it. Then in a combat you just say "Power pool is in the lightning blast and force field." point cost and endurence is already written down, nothing to calculate. And this is as complicated as it gets. Most of the time it's much easier.
The the players who make simple combats take all night are the one's who go "Ok, 75points...i'll take this, add this, take away this...ok, two points left to spend, let me find something for the..." then five minutes later say "Ok, done. I'll hold my action." Drives me crazy..
Champions does a great job of simulating the genre. It's generic like Gurps but more cinematic than realistic. I still routinely come up with characters ideas for 3rded DnD that I can't do in the system because I still think in Hero System terms.
Combat can go pretty fast is people are prepared. Pretty slow if they are inexperienced or unprepared. Someone gave the example of a 75pt power pool and asked how many points the powers were and how much end they cost. I've used power pools alot of times, all you need to do is have a set sheet of powers you use together. It might take a half hour to an hour to create it. Then in a combat you just say "Power pool is in the lightning blast and force field." point cost and endurence is already written down, nothing to calculate. And this is as complicated as it gets. Most of the time it's much easier.
The the players who make simple combats take all night are the one's who go "Ok, 75points...i'll take this, add this, take away this...ok, two points left to spend, let me find something for the..." then five minutes later say "Ok, done. I'll hold my action." Drives me crazy..
Played a few games, but my favorite was the old Marvel system (never tried the Saga version).
The system's character generation methods were... well, they sure as heck weren't balanced, but they did open up ways for you to be creative to try to get things to work. The character advancement system needed some work, too. Just too darned slow.
However, for actual play, we found it to be a blast. And not just for playing the well known Marvel heroes in combat. It's as open to actual plot as any game out there
The system's character generation methods were... well, they sure as heck weren't balanced, but they did open up ways for you to be creative to try to get things to work. The character advancement system needed some work, too. Just too darned slow.
However, for actual play, we found it to be a blast. And not just for playing the well known Marvel heroes in combat. It's as open to actual plot as any game out there
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hmmm.
I definitely vote for DC Heroes/Blood of Heroes as my time and tested Super hero rpg.
DC Heroes:
*It has a fast playable system and lets you play all ranges of supers. However, the lower level thugs/street hero playability is not "fuzzy", its just flat out bland!! Batman level is okay, but drop to Robin level and everyone starts looking the same(a small exaggaration, but not much). It has a point buy system, but is about average on the amount of both time consumption/brain damage and character control
*For me, it has the perfect mix of customization and playability, plus the right amount of "pick-up-dice-an-play" factor
Champions. Speaking as a Champions ex-patriot (4 years, hard time served, baby):
*It is MATH INTENSIVE!!! Say all you want about spreadsheets and "once you get the system down" malarky and represent!! However thats not necessarily a negative. It allows for an almost freakish control of your character's abilities and allows you to micromanage your hero. Thats its greatest strength and its greatest weakness. You can't really pick up and play near as easy as most hero games and the combats CAN become as boggled as any intense AOO log jams as seen in 3E D&D. It requires a lot maintenance, for players AND GMs. But for customization and ability to model your campaign to your tastes, nothing touches Champions. flat out. Beware this double edged sword.
Heroes Unlimited:
*This was my first supers rpg and it holds a warm spot in me heart!! Its also a pale, Bizarro version of what the D20 game system is becoming. If only Palladium could get off its high horse, i think they could score big with D20 Heroes Unlimited. But what do i know, eh?
Marvel Saga:
*This is the perfect pick-up-and-play super heroes. Think Magic the Gathering, for a representation of its quick access. However it sacrifices WAY to much system intergrity or mechanics playability for my tastes. But a whole lot of people like it, so......
Aberrant:
*This game has a great setting, but the system fell apart between the dice pools, and terribly unbalanced power system. Half the powers were useless, have were more powerful than the rest. Offense was overstated and defense was not going out of your suite at the four seasons. Damn the WW system!! I was pissed!!
*i've succesfully used the setting in the DC Heroes system.
*Did i say it has a GREAT setting???
I've honestly played at least 15-20 other superhero games (try me) and thes are the only ones i can really plug and keep a straight face.
Later
I definitely vote for DC Heroes/Blood of Heroes as my time and tested Super hero rpg.
DC Heroes:
*It has a fast playable system and lets you play all ranges of supers. However, the lower level thugs/street hero playability is not "fuzzy", its just flat out bland!! Batman level is okay, but drop to Robin level and everyone starts looking the same(a small exaggaration, but not much). It has a point buy system, but is about average on the amount of both time consumption/brain damage and character control
*For me, it has the perfect mix of customization and playability, plus the right amount of "pick-up-dice-an-play" factor
Champions. Speaking as a Champions ex-patriot (4 years, hard time served, baby):
*It is MATH INTENSIVE!!! Say all you want about spreadsheets and "once you get the system down" malarky and represent!! However thats not necessarily a negative. It allows for an almost freakish control of your character's abilities and allows you to micromanage your hero. Thats its greatest strength and its greatest weakness. You can't really pick up and play near as easy as most hero games and the combats CAN become as boggled as any intense AOO log jams as seen in 3E D&D. It requires a lot maintenance, for players AND GMs. But for customization and ability to model your campaign to your tastes, nothing touches Champions. flat out. Beware this double edged sword.
Heroes Unlimited:
*This was my first supers rpg and it holds a warm spot in me heart!! Its also a pale, Bizarro version of what the D20 game system is becoming. If only Palladium could get off its high horse, i think they could score big with D20 Heroes Unlimited. But what do i know, eh?
Marvel Saga:
*This is the perfect pick-up-and-play super heroes. Think Magic the Gathering, for a representation of its quick access. However it sacrifices WAY to much system intergrity or mechanics playability for my tastes. But a whole lot of people like it, so......
Aberrant:
*This game has a great setting, but the system fell apart between the dice pools, and terribly unbalanced power system. Half the powers were useless, have were more powerful than the rest. Offense was overstated and defense was not going out of your suite at the four seasons. Damn the WW system!! I was pissed!!
*i've succesfully used the setting in the DC Heroes system.
*Did i say it has a GREAT setting???
I've honestly played at least 15-20 other superhero games (try me) and thes are the only ones i can really plug and keep a straight face.
Later
morrolan
First Post
I've read and played quite a fewof the superhero games out there in search of the perfect system. For our group, Champions seemed too bland and the Palladium rules too broken. The two that we played longest abd had the most fun with were Villains and Vigilantes and Marvel SAGA. Plus V&V had Jeff Dee artwork. WOTC bring back Jeff Dee!
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