Where is metamagic going?

[WizarDru]

I changed it about two weeks back. I mean....Everybody Loves Magical Trevor.

 

[Umbran]

I don't know, but this trend also makes me wonder if in future editions we are going to see major changes to metamagic (if it's still going to exist, of course). I seriously think that in an eventual 4e metamagic will always be done on the fly.

Oddly, current trends are frequently a poor indicator of where future alterations will occur. In going from 1e to 2e, or 2e to 3e, the designers didn't sit back, look at all the previous development, and then extend that further. So don't expect them to do so for 4e.

 

[Mac Callum]

The trend is towards making metamagic more usable.

I'd say that, by 4E, some of these options will be rolled into the core. It's just more interesting if a 3rd level wizard can Empower or Maximise one spell/day. Consider how much play takes place between 1st and 10th level (especially in the RPGA Living campaigns), and then how useful Metamagic is at those levels.

...or they could just play the Magister from Arcana Unearthed.

I have a question ... has any supplement come up with an item that allows Sorcerors to cast spells they haven't learned? I'm imagining an Amulet of Sorcerous Fireball or some such that allows a Sorceror to use their own spell slots. Anything like this?

 

[Olgar Shiverstone]

Didn't Andy Collins say that they had come up with a way to "fix" metamagic, but it was considered too radical to introduce in 3.5? Anyone know what that was? (Assuming you think metamagic is broke and needs "fixing", which I'm not convinced of, but anyway ...)

 

[Elder-Basilisk]

WRT to the spontaneous or during preparation use of metamagic rods for spellcasters who prep spells, it's actually more advantageous for the prepared spellcasters to have them be usable during preparation.

The 12th level wizard sits down and uses the rod three times during preparation:
1 extended see invisibility, 1 extended heroism, 1 extended greater magic weapon.

Then he casts them all.

Then, 4 hours later, when the heroism and See Invisibility wear off, he uses a pearl of power II and a pearl of power III to recall the extended see invisibility that used to be in the slot and the extended heroism that used to be in the slot and casts them again.

And, better yet, both times, he casts the spells without having to have the rods in-hand. So, he could prepare a spell both silent and empowered with two rods and then cast it (Preparing spells doesn't require a free hand as far as I can tell) silent and empowered. Or, at the very least, he can prepare a variety of silent, empowered, and extended spells and use them all in the course of one combat without having to drop one rod and retrieve another.

Requiring the rods to be used during casting doesn't allow either trick:
1. The rod has to be in hand during the casting. Therefore, unless it's a stilled or verbal only spell or you somehow have extra hands, you can only apply one metamagic rod to the spell.
2. Since the spell that is prepared is not actually extended, quickened, empowered, whatever, a pearl of power only recovers the base spell--not the spell modified by metamagic.

 

[Buttercup]

I would like to know more about your opinion... Why do think they are overrated?

You answered my question in your next two paragraphs.

I sometimes think that metamagic feats are quite "costly" because compared to other feats they may be effectively used more rarely. This at least applies to the "safety metamagic" such as Still Spell and Silent Spell.

Another thing is that you can say you pay twice for them, once when spending the feat and again when using it, since you need to increase the spell level.

That's why. And generally, I think spellcasters can do more than enough damage without bothering with metamagic feats. Not that I would stop a player from taking one or more, mind you.

 

[Umbran]

And generally, I think spellcasters can do more than enough damage without bothering with metamagic feats.

Well, that is as it should be. If the feats were required just to keep up, they shouldn't be optional.

 

[Hypersmurf]

So, he could prepare a spell both silent and empowered with two rods and then cast it (Preparing spells doesn't require a free hand as far as I can tell) silent and empowered.

"A caster may only use one metamagic rod on any given spell, but it is permissible to combine a rod with metamagic feats possessed by the rod’s wielder."

-Hyp.

 

[coyote6]

I have a question ... has any supplement come up with an item that allows Sorcerors to cast spells they haven't learned? I'm imagining an Amulet of Sorcerous Fireball or some such that allows a Sorceror to use their own spell slots. Anything like this?

The Book of Hallowed Might II has "keyed spell items" that function something like that.

THere's also another book that had some item (a ring, I think; I want to say it was an FFG book, but I'm not sure. I alway forget which book it is) that gives a particular spell as, effectively, a bonus spell known. (FWIW, it cost spell level*spell level*1000 gp -- same price as a pearl of power.)

 

[Elder-Basilisk]

It's a line drive to right field... hypersmurf makes the catch.

"A caster may only use one metamagic rod on any given spell, but it is permissible to combine a rod with metamagic feats possessed by the rod’s wielder."

-Hyp.