Where is metamagic going?

[Voadam]

Don't know if anybody else had the same feeling as mine, but I think that recent products are showing a trend in how metamagic works that really is making me worry. :\

If you just play with core material and early 3ed edition supplements such as Tome & Blood, metamagic has its greatest limitation IMHO not in the level increase cost but in the preparation requirements. This of course makes spontaneous casters the masters of metamagic because they can do it on the fly.

T&B introduced the Metamagic rods, so you have to restrict yourself to 3e core if you want to escape them.

 

[Telperion]

What Li Shenron is getting at, Telperion, is that Sorcerers don't have to worry about getting their spells disrupted any more than any other caster - it doesn't take 1 full round to cast meta'ed spells, it's a full-round action, same as a fighter doing his maximum attacks, or delivering a coup de grace. It's still a spell-casting, but suffers as much chance to disrupt as any standard action spell. It's a common rules misinterpretation, one that was cleared up in 3.5.

Right. Now I found it. My apologies. I shouldn't post on a bad day.

 

[WizarDru]

T&B introduced the Metamagic rods, so you have to restrict yourself to 3e core if you want to escape them.

Just to clarify, you know they're in 3.5 core, correct?

 

[Voadam]

Just to clarify, you know they're in 3.5 core, correct?

Right that's why I said 3e core. Or were you addressing the OP?

 

[WizarDru]

Nope, just checking.
Some folks don't always make the distinction between 3e and 3.5e.

 

[ARandomGod]

Well


In my opinion metamagic rods are the only time a competent non-spontanious spellcaster will ever use a metamagic feat.

Now, sure, this depends on campaign style, and GM's... some GM's don't allow any time for spell research. But if you have one of those GM's you shouldn't be playing a non-spontanious caster anyhow.

If you prepare spells you're just wasting a feat when you take metamagic, as it's simplicity itself to research a version of the spell that's identical to a metamagiced spell... AND the save DC will be appropriate, unlike metamagic.

 

[Thanee]

I can see how the wording can be interepeted as vague. But I wonder that if they meant for them to be only for sorcerors or preparation, why they didn't call that out specifically.

You are certainly not the only person to wonder about that... either way, however they are meant to work, why didn't they just say so.

The description says nothing at all about how they are used.

In particular, I keep coming back to this line: "All the rods described here are use-activated (but casting spells in a threatened area still draws an attack of opportunity). " Yes, that could be purely for the benefit of sorcerors and bards...but I tend to doubt it...

Well, use-activated... now how do wizards use metamagic?

especially since we all agree that wizards benefit more from these items than they do, and would be the first people to shell out the ducats for them.

That's only if they were to use them spontaneously, otherwise they are pretty equal.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Spatula]

Metamagic is a lot more flexible than researching new spells (even for wizards), and spell research is very expensive and time-consuming.

In my opinion metamagic rods are the only time a competent non-spontanious spellcaster will ever use a metamagic feat.

Now, sure, this depends on campaign style, and GM's... some GM's don't allow any time for spell research. But if you have one of those GM's you shouldn't be playing a non-spontanious caster anyhow.

If you prepare spells you're just wasting a feat when you take metamagic, as it's simplicity itself to research a version of the spell that's identical to a metamagiced spell... AND the save DC will be appropriate, unlike metamagic.

 

[MerricB]

The trend is towards making metamagic more usable.

The Rods of Metamagic were the first step.

The second step was taken in the Miniatures Handbook with the Sudden Metamagic feats - e.g. Sudden Empower allows you to (spontaneously) apply Empower Spell to a spell once per day without changing its level, etc.

Then you have Complete Divine and its Divine Metamagic.

I'd say that, by 4E, some of these options will be rolled into the core. It's just more interesting if a 3rd level wizard can Empower or Maximise one spell/day. Consider how much play takes place between 1st and 10th level (especially in the RPGA Living campaigns), and then how useful Metamagic is at those levels.

Cheers!

 

[reanjr]

...

I never noticed that your Avatar was Magical Trevor before. Is that new? (Magical Trevor rocks)