Where is my Freaking Mule?!

[coyote6]

Actually, I already have it. There was a Rolemaster book released called "...and a 10' pole." It was essentially a book of "roleplaying items" sorted by era with some brief descriptions and price based on era.

Now, I never played Rolemaster. However, that doesn't matter for this book. There is just a smidgen of rules content, so it works for every game I might want to play. I don't see why WotC would be able to sell me something I already have, and don't see why they'd want to duplicate something that already exists.

That book is actually still available, directly from ICE. It's right here.

 

[ExploderWizard]

4E economics turns the simple act of buying a mule into a complex exercise that scales with level:

A heroic tier mule costs 10-15 gp and can carry loot and gear as an at-will ability.

A paragon tier mule costs 5000-7500 gp, and has the same abilities as the heroic tier mule. In addition, the paragon tier mule can fly a number of squares equal to its move each turn. The paragon tier mule answers the age old question: when donkeys fly?

The epic tier mule costs 45000-60000 gp, has the same abilities as the paragon tier mule and can also perform overland flight. If anything is added to, or removed from the mule's pack during flight (a minor action) the mule crashes.

 

[El Mahdi]

4E economics turns the simple act of buying a mule into a complex exercise that scales with level:

A heroic tier mule costs 10-15 gp and can carry loot and gear as an at-will ability.

So, the standard Lootbearing DonkeyHorse (as named earlier in the thread). Cool.

A paragon tier mule costs 5000-7500 gp, and has the same abilities as the heroic tier mule. In addition, the paragon tier mule can fly a number of squares equal to its move each turn. The paragon tier mule answers the age old question: when donkeys fly?

So, this is the PegasusWinged DonkeyHorse?

The epic tier mule costs 45000-60000 gp, has the same abilities as the paragon tier mule and can also perform overland flight. If anything is added to, or removed from the mule's pack during flight (a minor action) the mule crashes.

We'll just call this one an AirBus.

 

[korjik]

Always, why?

On-topic: A book of interesting non-combat stuff like the 2E book mentioned above would be cool, but then again it already exists and would still be useful in 4E. An in-print version, or a-hem WotC, the original version in pdf would be welcome for those who want it. Or a new Stronghold Builders book (again the original in pdf would be nice). But I don't see anyone convincing a company to write a brand new book of useless stuff. It would just be someone assigning abitrary costs to mundane items. Others have already pointed out that you can do that without attributable prep time. Mule? Already answered that. 10' pole? Sure you got one. How much? Not enough money to care.

So if everyone shows interest in buying a book of useless stuff, WOTC will simply ignore that?

 

[korjik]

For all the people who think I should just ad-lib all this during the game:

I could just make it up myself. I could also make the whole freakin game up myself too. I would even get the math right.

I lack both time (I should be working on my PhD dissertation not my game), and desire to do it.

I would much prefer to spend money on product generated by someone who does game design for a living than generate it myself.

That way, I can support my FLGS, I can support WOTC, and I can get a much nicer looking product than I could generate myself.

Alot of the point of this thread is to see if there are others who think the same way Zaran and I do. We want to see if there is actually some desire for this kind of product. Looks like there is at least some desire.

Lastly, I would like to thank those who have pointed out other companies 'books of useless stuff'. I will look into those when I get the chance.

 

[coyote6]

Oh, one more "book of stuff" to keep an eye out for -- sometime this year (I hope), SJGames should be releasing GURPS Low Tech (for GURPS 4e) and 3 PDF companions, that appear to be covering all kinds of low-tech gear & concerns. (For example, the three companions are sub-titled "Philosophers and Kings", "Weapons and Warriors", and "Daily Life, Tools, and Trade".)

 

[Votan]

For all the people who think I should just ad-lib all this during the game:

I could just make it up myself. I could also make the whole freakin game up myself too. I would even get the math right.

I lack both time (I should be working on my PhD dissertation not my game), and desire to do it.

I would much prefer to spend money on product generated by someone who does game design for a living than generate it myself.

That way, I can support my FLGS, I can support WOTC, and I can get a much nicer looking product than I could generate myself.

Alot of the point of this thread is to see if there are others who think the same way Zaran and I do. We want to see if there is actually some desire for this kind of product. Looks like there is at least some desire.

Lastly, I would like to thank those who have pointed out other companies 'books of useless stuff'. I will look into those when I get the chance.

Agreed. When I just "guess" at a price on the fly I always get something wrong. D&D economics has enough issues without the DM creating a new set due to random bad guesses as to the costs of items.

Later on, I would ignore these costs as players with wealth beyond the dreams of avarice can likely afford a 10 foot pole.

 

[Ourph]

For all the people who think I should just ad-lib all this during the game:

I could just make it up myself. I could also make the whole freakin game up myself too. I would even get the math right.

I lack both time (I should be working on my PhD dissertation not my game), and desire to do it.

I would much prefer to spend money on product generated by someone who does game design for a living than generate it myself.

I think the problem that some people are having is that so many of the examples being given as "something we'd like to see" are either 1) already present in the rules (sailing ships) or 2) are easily approximated by just reducing the price of something already in the books (ex: Why can't a mule just be a cheaper riding horse with the same stats?).

The thing is, if the item is truly as mundane as a pack mule or a 10' pole, you don't need a professional designer writing the rules for it. There is no "the math" to get wrong. It's a 10' wooden pole... you know, as in... a stick. It should be as close to free as makes no difference, at least as far as adventurers (who deal in gold) are concerned. I think people are just having a hard time understanding where the burden is for a DM in saying "OK Joe the Fighter, you now own a 10' stick. It does all the things you'd expect a 10' stick to be able to do.". I think people are also having a hard time understanding the value of a book that's filled with entries like....

10' stick, weight: 5 lbs, cost: 1cp
A 10' stick is a straight 10' long wooden stick. It might be good for poking things and stuff.

 

[ExploderWizard]

Then don't start a snarky thread asking where your freaking mule is. Most of the stuff in your proposed Book of Mundane Stuff (TM) would take less time for your DM to come up with on the fly than it took you to post. Stuff can exist outside of a rulebook. (Weird, I know!)

Free yourself of the burden of precision from rulebooks and prep time for this sort of stuff.

Your player asks to buy a mule. You say ok, you buy a mule. He says how much is it...and if they are around 1-3 level, you make up a number on the fly like 5gp from the local vendor. And if they are 4+ level you say "don't worry about it, you can afford it without noticing the cost really". And that's it.

And when they ask for the stats, you say "it will get you where you are going faster that your feet for long distances, but if you try to use it in combat for anything more than an object filling a space, it will die like a minion".

And that's it. You don't need a book. You don't need stats. You don't need prep time for this. You don't need anything more than the shortest of conversations for this.

You can do it. You'll probably find it becomes a freeing feeling to just do this sort of thing on the fly, and maybe other things in your game will come more easily on the fly.

Funnily enough, I'm playing my first 4e campaign with a brand new DM. And I mean, brand spanking new. It's her first time DMing ANYTHING. I wanted to buy a horse, didn't have the cash and she decided on the fly that I could rent horses for x sp per day.

How hard is it to say, Mule- riding horse stats, no attacks, 10 gp?

After all, why does the mule actually need stats? It's not like it's going to be used in battle most likely. So, why worry about it?

"There you have it. If it doesn't matter in combat or have any impact on powering you up for said combat then just handwave it. Only items pertaining to the balanced treadmill of power growth mean enough to have any description of utility worth noting.

You don't need tons of books and stats for the "important" stuff either so why is having metric tons of that flavorless crap published considered to be just fine?"




This post was made by my evil twin who hijacked my account, after viewing Star Trek epidode 5: The Enemy Within a few too many times.

So set your vorpal blades to behead, buckle on some bracers of daily forgettable power, travel to the outer planes and cleave your way to glory!!

 

[Piratecat]

What the hell are you people doing, turning a funny thread into an edition war? Stop. Now.