Cantrips were officially ruled to scale by character level. I think they were always intended to be that way. That is the only one I can think of. The cleric domain isn't a counterexample. You get the feature at 1st level of Cleric. Unless there is an official ruling that I missed.
D&D 5E Why are vague rules praised?
- Thread starter Derren
- Start date
Cantrips were officially ruled to scale by character level. I think they were always intended to be that way. That is the only one I can think of. The cleric domain isn't a counterexample. You get the feature at 1st level of Cleric. Unless there is an official ruling that I missed.
This is one of those rules where it's easy to forget (at least I forgot) that the rule says "two attacks" instead of "an additional attack". I'm sure someone made sure that the rule said "two" not "additional" so someone couldn't take Barbarian 5/Fighter 5/Paladin 5/Ranger 5 and have 4 attacks.
Psikerlord#
Explorer
Yeah I think this is a very smart move. The DM is the advantage of tabletop over a cool RPG computer game. The DM can adjudicate stuff which allows for more options., which makes the game more fun.
Having said that, I hope the DMG includes a big blurb about encouraging DMs to make the game their own, to tweak rules to suit their table, to make improvised rulings on cool things not specifically captured by the rules.
I do think the OP has a point re the PHB. There should have been a blurb in there about "some rules are vague on purpose to allow your table to interpret in a way that suits your playstyle". Be up front about it so everyone knows what the deal is.
painted_klown
First Post
While we are hashing out rules, and how you like to run them, I am completely lost on how you would handle the passage of time as a DM.
From Players Basic rules version 0.2, page 63/115:
Time
In situations where keeping track of the passage of
time is important, the DM determines the time a task
requires. The DM might use a different time scale
depending on the context of the situation at hand. In
a dungeon environment, the adventurers’ movement
happens on a scale of minutes. It takes them about a
minute to creep down a long hallway, another minute
to check for traps on the door at the end of the hall, and
a good ten minutes to search the chamber beyond for
anything interesting or valuable.
In a city or wilderness, a scale of hours is often more
appropriate. Adventurers eager to reach the lonely tower
at the heart of the forest hurry across those fifteen miles
in just under four hours’ time.
For long journeys, a scale of days works best.
Following the road from Baldur’s Gate to Waterdeep, the
adventurers spend four uneventful days before a goblin
ambush interrupts their journey.
In combat and other fast-paced situations, the game
relies on rounds, a 6-second span of time described
in chapter 9.
This is from page 67/115:
Short Rest
A short rest is a period of downtime, at least 1 hour long,
during which a character does nothing more strenuous
than eating, drinking, reading, and tending to wounds.
A character can spend one or more Hit Dice at the end
of a short rest, up to the character’s maximum number
of Hit Dice, which is equal to the character’s level. For
each Hit Die spent in this way, the player rolls the die
and adds the character’s Constitution modifier to it. The
character regains hit points equal to the total. The player
can decide to spend an additional Hit Die after each roll.
A character regains some spent Hit Dice upon finishing
a long rest, as explained below.
Long Rest
A long rest is a period of extended downtime, at least 8
hours long, during which a character sleeps or performs
light activity: reading, talking, eating, or standing watch
for no more than 2 hours. If the rest is interrupted by a
period of strenuous activity—at least 1 hour of walking,
fighting, casting spells, or similar adventuring activity—
the characters must begin the rest again to gain any
benefit from it.
At the end of a long rest, a character regains all lost
hit points. The character also regains spent Hit Dice, up
to a number of dice equal to half of the character’s total
number of them (minimum of one die). For example, if a
character has eight Hit Dice, he or she can regain four
spent Hit Dice upon finishing a long rest.
A character can’t benefit from more than one long rest
in a 24-hour period, and a character must have at least
1 hit point at the start of the rest to gain its benefits.
Then, we have the between adventure times, and downtime activities time as well (pages 67-68/115).
Clearly, these aren't played out in real time, and having no idea how it should be, as the DM, do you simply get to say something along the lines of "Ok all, you have defeated the evil ruler of castle Charlock, now you all have 8 hrs to rest, partake in downtime activities, etc"
Is it solely up to the DM to tell the players that they have a "short" rest period vs a "long" rest period? Are these rest period activities played out as a gaming session in between campaigns?
What if you have your party on a long trek that would take multiple days? Do you just say, after walking for a full day, with no encounters and getting a lot of ground covered, the party decides to set up camp for the night." I assume during this "camping time" the PCs will be able to heal up as stated by the long rest rules?
Sorry for the n00b questions, but I am lost when it comes to passage of time. If this is the wrong place to be asking these questions, please let me know and I will edit my posts, and ask these elsewhere.
From Players Basic rules version 0.2, page 63/115:
Time
In situations where keeping track of the passage of
time is important, the DM determines the time a task
requires. The DM might use a different time scale
depending on the context of the situation at hand. In
a dungeon environment, the adventurers’ movement
happens on a scale of minutes. It takes them about a
minute to creep down a long hallway, another minute
to check for traps on the door at the end of the hall, and
a good ten minutes to search the chamber beyond for
anything interesting or valuable.
In a city or wilderness, a scale of hours is often more
appropriate. Adventurers eager to reach the lonely tower
at the heart of the forest hurry across those fifteen miles
in just under four hours’ time.
For long journeys, a scale of days works best.
Following the road from Baldur’s Gate to Waterdeep, the
adventurers spend four uneventful days before a goblin
ambush interrupts their journey.
In combat and other fast-paced situations, the game
relies on rounds, a 6-second span of time described
in chapter 9.
This is from page 67/115:
Short Rest
A short rest is a period of downtime, at least 1 hour long,
during which a character does nothing more strenuous
than eating, drinking, reading, and tending to wounds.
A character can spend one or more Hit Dice at the end
of a short rest, up to the character’s maximum number
of Hit Dice, which is equal to the character’s level. For
each Hit Die spent in this way, the player rolls the die
and adds the character’s Constitution modifier to it. The
character regains hit points equal to the total. The player
can decide to spend an additional Hit Die after each roll.
A character regains some spent Hit Dice upon finishing
a long rest, as explained below.
Long Rest
A long rest is a period of extended downtime, at least 8
hours long, during which a character sleeps or performs
light activity: reading, talking, eating, or standing watch
for no more than 2 hours. If the rest is interrupted by a
period of strenuous activity—at least 1 hour of walking,
fighting, casting spells, or similar adventuring activity—
the characters must begin the rest again to gain any
benefit from it.
At the end of a long rest, a character regains all lost
hit points. The character also regains spent Hit Dice, up
to a number of dice equal to half of the character’s total
number of them (minimum of one die). For example, if a
character has eight Hit Dice, he or she can regain four
spent Hit Dice upon finishing a long rest.
A character can’t benefit from more than one long rest
in a 24-hour period, and a character must have at least
1 hit point at the start of the rest to gain its benefits.
Then, we have the between adventure times, and downtime activities time as well (pages 67-68/115).
Clearly, these aren't played out in real time, and having no idea how it should be, as the DM, do you simply get to say something along the lines of "Ok all, you have defeated the evil ruler of castle Charlock, now you all have 8 hrs to rest, partake in downtime activities, etc"
Is it solely up to the DM to tell the players that they have a "short" rest period vs a "long" rest period? Are these rest period activities played out as a gaming session in between campaigns?
What if you have your party on a long trek that would take multiple days? Do you just say, after walking for a full day, with no encounters and getting a lot of ground covered, the party decides to set up camp for the night." I assume during this "camping time" the PCs will be able to heal up as stated by the long rest rules?
Sorry for the n00b questions, but I am lost when it comes to passage of time. If this is the wrong place to be asking these questions, please let me know and I will edit my posts, and ask these elsewhere.
Last edited:
MechaPilot
Explorer
I think it's a shame that they went so vague on rules like stronghold construction, which could have benefited from being more clear, but that they were overly specific about crafting magic items requiring one to be a spellcaster (which I think is utter bunk if you're requiring special materials for the crafting anyway) and that the spellcaster must be one who uses spell slots.
I would have greatly preferred a language that was meant to posit potential options for the DM to consider and decide upon. For example, they could have said that the crafter may have to be a caster instead of must be a spell slot using caster.
I would have greatly preferred a language that was meant to posit potential options for the DM to consider and decide upon. For example, they could have said that the crafter may have to be a caster instead of must be a spell slot using caster.
Mr0wlington
First Post
Yeah, I'm hoping to see much more about PC's building strongholds becoming leaders in the world. As it is, I'm thinking about giving the characters an approximate square footage and some graph paper and saying "have fun". I'm probably going to check out the 3rd edition strongholds book again too, but maybe look back to 2e for followers (if anyone knows anything about this, please let me know the general idea about how to implement it), or *maybe* the 3e version and require the leadership feat.
MechaPilot
Explorer
I'd like to see some 5e tips about PCs attracting followers as well. Such a thing is rather an important part of recreating one of my favorite characters from previous editions.
DMZ2112
Chaotic Looseleaf
I think your reaction is understandable, and for what it is worth I think that if D&D5 had been released as the follow-up to AD&D2 you might see more people agreeing with you. But for my part, at least, D&D5 is coming on the heels of 15 years of incredibly specific minutiae. Your mileage may vary, of course, but I was ready for a change!
The flip side of the coin is that, as D&D4 clearly demonstrated, Page 42 (the dungeon master can do whatever he likes) is not /sufficient/. You can't just say, "Here are the (incredibly specific) rules, change them at will." D&D is a cooperative game, and if the dungeon master tries to say the books are "wrong," his players are going to pitch a fit, and to some extent rightly so -- they paid as much money for the books as their dungeon master did -- they have a very real right to use them as printed. More established groups have less of an issue with this, but that doesn't mean it's not an issue for a lot of us.
By proposing a rule but not spelling it out, D&D5 /requires/ players to ask their dungeon master what it means, making dungeon master fiat a real part of the game again for the first time in 20 years. It's the best of both worlds -- a codified ruleset that still encourages individualized play.
1. You have defeated the evil ruler. What do you want to do? Go home and rest? Ok. Let's pack up for the night and I'll come up with something next week.
2. After walking for (roll for random encounters and getting none) a full day with no encounters and covering (looks up wilderness movement) 24 miles you set up camp for the night. (roll random nighttime encounter table)
Gary Gygax in the 1e DMG emphasized how important accurate tracking of time was in what was, to me, the most memorable section. It highlighted, for some reason, just how alive the world was and how much the game revolved around the characters and how important they were.
When you put the time in to make the world seem real, the players notice. Time passes (mark it off on your world's calendar!), weather happens (determine/roll for weather weeks in advance. Players notice when you instantly know what the weather is like!), seasons change.
painted_klown
First Post
WOW! That's some great stuff there. Thanks for the tips! This is exactly the kind of advice I was looking for.
BTW, I assume when you say worlds calendar, then you are talking about using a regular calendar to track the passing time in your game setting/campaign world?
