5E Why did they design Demiplane to suck?

Saelorn

Hero
So, I looked up the spell again, and I realized it actually does kinda suck, in the way I care about, which is allowing a wizard to make a real demiplane. Here's an example of what I imagine when I think of a demiplane made by a high level wizard:

A large tower (or smallish castle) sits atop an earthburg floating in a stormy sky. If you travel more than a few hundred feet in any direction, you reappear out of the storm from the opposite side.
When I think of a real demiplane, I think of Ravenloft: The Demiplane of Dread. Anything much smaller than that is a disservice to the title.

Level 9 spells are the most powerful magic that could ever possibly exist. If there has ever been any spellcaster within the entire history of the setting who has done anything useful or interesting, then a level 9 spell should be able to facilitate that. Because if they can't, then it creates a situation where NPCs are better than PCs, just because they're NPCs. And that's not cool.

As it is, this spell should really just be renamed pocket dimension.
The same could be said of rope trick, which is kind of sad, that the difference in spell levels amounts to basically no change in their functionality.
 

Ganders

Explorer
I'm surprised nobody mentioned how easy it is to get stuck in your own demiplane. This seems like an oversight -- there should be a way for the Demiplane spell to re-open the door from the inside.

If you somehow stay in it past the hour, or someone casts Dispel Magic on your door while you're inside, there's no way out. Casting Demiplane might get you to a different demiplane, but it won't get you home. If you don't happen to know Plane Shift, Banishment, or Astral Projection (and have the right compontents) you're pretty screwed -- and even those are likely to deposit you someplace unintended and inconvenient (but at least you're out).

It seems like such an obvious oversight. But then I realized there are other oversights -- for instance, what happens if you tunnel through the floors and walls? What if you want to end the spell after less than an hour -- can you dismiss the door with an action? And so I realized there IS an answer to the OP''s question. Demiplane sucks because it's inentionally incomplete. There's supposed to a another whole paragraph about how it works and what you can do with it -- but that was left up to individual DMs to fill in, as suits their game.
 

gyor

Legend
I'm surprised nobody mentioned how easy it is to get stuck in your own demiplane. This seems like an oversight -- there should be a way for the Demiplane spell to re-open the door from the inside.

If you somehow stay in it past the hour, or someone casts Dispel Magic on your door while you're inside, there's no way out. Casting Demiplane might get you to a different demiplane, but it won't get you home. If you don't happen to know Plane Shift, Banishment, or Astral Projection (and have the right compontents) you're pretty screwed -- and even those are likely to deposit you someplace unintended and inconvenient (but at least you're out).

It seems like such an obvious oversight. But then I realized there are other oversights -- for instance, what happens if you tunnel through the floors and walls? What if you want to end the spell after less than an hour -- can you dismiss the door with an action? And so I realized there IS an answer to the OP''s question. Demiplane sucks because it's inentionally incomplete. There's supposed to a another whole paragraph about how it works and what you can do with it -- but that was left up to individual DMs to fill in, as suits their game.
I didn't think of that. It's an even worse spell then I thought. A spell that creates a demiplane should be one of the coolest spells, not the lamest. Magnificent Mansion is 10 times the better spell, it's one weakness is you can't make it permanent (maybe with a Wish Spell).
 

JasonZZ

Community Supporter
Don't forget the Oubliette:

1. Get Repelling Blast.

2. While the BBEG is fighting your allies, cast demiplane on the wall of the BBEG's lair, and open the door as your free interaction.

3. Maneuver so the BBEG is between you and the door.

4. Fire off a volley of eldritch blasts.

5. Have an allied spellcaster cast dispel magic on the door using an 8th-level slot.

Note the lack of any place where Legendary Resistance could be used to shut this down. And it's remarkable how few monsters, even giant high-level legendary monsters like archdevils, have access to planar travel.
So you're leaving them to be a problem for future generations? Maybe they have cultists/minions who will spend all kinds of time trying to free them? It sounds to me like you're justifying the traditional "unbeatable evil bound to protect the world" shtick. :)
 

Maxperson

Morkus from Orkus
It seems like such an obvious oversight. But then I realized there are other oversights -- for instance, what happens if you tunnel through the floors and walls? What if you want to end the spell after less than an hour -- can you dismiss the door with an action? And so I realized there IS an answer to the OP''s question.
I don't think these are oversights at all. One of the main precepts of 5e is ruling over rules, so a lot of things are written vaguely to enable each DM to decide for himself how it works.

Demiplane sucks because it's inentionally incomplete. There's supposed to a another whole paragraph about how it works and what you can do with it -- but that was left up to individual DMs to fill in, as suits their game.
I don't think it sucks. It just meanst that one DM might rule that if you dig through you fall into nothingness forever. Another might decided that it wraps around to the other side of your demiplane. A third DM might decide that it expands the size of your demiplane. And so on. To me that's a strength.

When too much is spelled out in detail, people tend to stop being as creative about things. They just stay within those detailed bounds. When things are vague like demiplane, the player might dig through hoping to find out X, Y or Z and the DM can go with it, or decide that it's A, B or C.
 

MarkB

Legend
Things to do with a larger demiplane:

1. Set the door horizontally on the seabed. Wait the full duration.

2. Set the door horizontally on the ceiling of the first room in the dungeon. Run away.
 
Eh, I like it. But I'm that weirdos who, if given my choice of some D&D-style magic spells, would take Create Bonfire, Mold Earth, Goodberry, Create or Destroy Water, Fabricate and Teleportation Circle.

I'm too practical for my own good, and an extradimensional studio apartment sounds quite lovely and quite practical.
 

catman1132000

Villager
I don't think it sucks. I use it mostly as a way to transport massive stockpiles of stuff to anywhere. I also am a necromancer, and since Zombies and other undead need next to nothing to survive, I use it to carry a backup zombie army everywhere.
 
Two people in the thread, perhaps more if I misread, mentioned Demiplane being part of a way to sustain multiple concentration spells. Is this true? If so does anyone know how and what they were talking about?
 

FarBeyondC

Explorer
Two people in the thread, perhaps more if I misread, mentioned Demiplane being part of a way to sustain multiple concentration spells. Is this true? If so does anyone know how and what they were talking about?
They may or may not be referring to the act of stockpiling Glyphs of Warding within a Demiplane, that can effectively be triggered whenever you need / want them.
 

FarBeyondC

Explorer
Why is Demiplane needed to stack spell glyphs? Or do they mean it is just safer to do so in your own private pocket dimension?
It's less a safety thing and more a portability thing.

You can reach a demiplane anywhere that:

A) Doesn't block / prevent the spell from being cast.
B) Has a flat surface (wall, floor, ceiling, etc)

Which means that any and every glyph you cast within said demiplane is a spell you can gain access to with nothing more than an action and (depending on the spell) some movement.
 
It's less a safety thing and more a portability thing.

You can reach a demiplane anywhere that:

A) Doesn't block / prevent the spell from being cast.
B) Has a flat surface (wall, floor, ceiling, etc)

Which means that any and every glyph you cast within said demiplane is a spell you can gain access to with nothing more than an action and (depending on the spell) some movement.
That's fine. The way it was worded earlier suggested to me that you needed Demiplane to do it, but you don't. It's just more convenient ( except for the spell slot for Demiplane ).
 

Esker

Hero
That's fine. The way it was worded earlier suggested to me that you needed Demiplane to do it, but you don't. It's just more convenient ( except for the spell slot for Demiplane ).
It's a bit more than convenience; with a Glyph of Warding the spell ends if the glyph is moved more than 10' from where you place it, it is dispelled. So that means that while in principle you can use it to maintain multiple concentration effects (or just "pocket" a spell to cast later), that only works if you are going to be in the same location at the time you need to use the spell, which, since the Glyph takes an hour to create, is a pretty big restriction that will usually prevent you from using the trick in combat.

But with demiplane, you can use an action and an 8th level slot to get, say, a concentration-free Globe of Invulnerability and a concentration-free Haste, say, provided you had some downtime and 200gp beforehand, allowing you to still use your concentration on, say, Animate Objects; so you have big offense and big defense at the same time.

I mean, given even a single day of downtime, sufficient gold, and access to demiplane and plane shift, you could prepare for the BBEG battle by loading up your demiplane with, by my count, after factoring in the need for plane shift to get out, and the need to upcast glyph to match the spell level you're storing, six buffs (at 20th level) ranging from 3rd to 6th level spells. So you could stack, say, Globe of Invulnerability, two conjured elementals, greater invisibility, haste, and fly, all concentration-free, and all cast with a single action and 8th level slot on the day you trigger them, and still Wish yourself a Simulacrum and cast Animate Objects, all by round 3.
 
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It's a bit more than convenience; with a Glyph of Warding the spell ends if the glyph is moved more than 10' from where you place it, it is dispelled. So that means that while in principle you can use it to maintain multiple concentration effects (or just "pocket" a spell to cast later), that only works if you are going to be in the same location at the time you need to use the spell, which, since the Glyph takes an hour to create, is a pretty big restriction that will usually prevent you from using the trick in combat.

But with demiplane, you can use an action and an 8th level slot to get, say, a concentration-free Globe of Invulnerability and a concentration-free Haste, say, provided you had some downtime and 200gp beforehand, allowing you to still use your concentration on, say, Animate Objects; so you have big offense and big defense at the same time.

I mean, given even a single day of downtime, sufficient gold, and access to demiplane and plane shift, you could prepare for the BBEG battle by loading up your demiplane with, by my count, after factoring in the need for plane shift to get out, and the need to upcast glyph to match the spell level you're storing, six buffs (at 20th level) ranging from 3rd to 6th level spells. So you could stack, say, Globe of Invulnerability, two conjured elementals, greater invisibility, haste, and fly, all concentration-free, and all cast with a single action and 8th level slot on the day you trigger them, and still Wish yourself a Simulacrum and cast Animate Objects, all by round 3.
If the BBEG just cast the glyphs in one hallway of his keep and walked down the hallway wouldn't he gain the same effect? Why do you need the Demiplane? You just need contiguous space to trigger the glyphs, right? ( To set them all off in the same round I mean. )
 

CapnZapp

Hero
If the BBEG just cast the glyphs in one hallway of his keep and walked down the hallway wouldn't he gain the same effect? Why do you need the Demiplane? You just need contiguous space to trigger the glyphs, right? ( To set them all off in the same round I mean. )
I think the point is just that.

You're in the BBEG's hallway, not your own.

Demiplane allows you to bring your hallway to the fight.
 

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