D&D 5E Why I Am Starting to Prefer 4d6 Drop the Lowest Over the Default Array.

[Oofta]

A meaningful shtick isn't (shouldn't be) "having an attack bonus". It is "physical combat", sometimes more specifically "archery" or "physical control." Fighters get features that make them better at these roles than wizards, even wizards with good stats.

If you roll up an array like 10, 12, 11, 9, 8, 10, there is still nothing stopping you from assuming the "good at physical combat" shtick. You just do it differently. You can be a Swashbuckler or a Moon Druid--either one works fine. You could also pick a different shtick.

But if a new person joins the group and runs exactly the same class and character but has all stats above 16 they will out-perform your character on a regular basis.

You may not care. You may be a better person for it.

That doesn't mean that it's fair, or that people with differing opinions on what makes the game fun for them are wrong.

I don't need to be "numerically superior". I don't need to have a better attack bonus than the other guy playing a fighter. But I don't want to play someone that is just plain mediocre at everything they do either.

Neither opinion is "more valid" than the other.

 

[Sacrosanct]

As an old school guy, part of me wants to say, "Random worked fine for decades without any major problems."

But then obviously a lot of people wanted equal stats for every PC or array would never have become a thing, let alone a popular option. So as far as I'm concerned, neither is any objectively better than the other. It seems pretty split down the board.

 

[FormerlyHemlock]

I can see both points, but the bolded part I think hits the difference in preferences. For example, I tend to agree with Hemlock on this for the same reasons he gave. But obviously Seule looks at it differently, and has different opinions on what "good" is. From my interpretation, in order to be "good", a PC has to have the higher/highest numerical bonus in a particular aspect, especially better than other party members.

Also bear in mind that in 5E, as opposed to other games like e.g. Shadowrun, there are aspects which have no numerical bonus associated with them at all. You can always pick those shticks regardless of what you roll (although RP considerations like low Int might conceivably restrict you from choosing some of them).

Choose one or more of the following:

The Supercharger: the guy who kicks other characters into overdrive with Bless/Haste/Warding Bond/Polymorph/Enhance Ability.
The Healer: the guy who keeps everybody uncursed, not turned to stone, alive, and at full HP.
The Arcanist: the guy who makes sure the party always has a safe place to rest, can always teleport to adventure and/or to safety, can decipher languages, etc.
The Summoner: the guy who spies or fights by proxy using conjured elementals, animals, familiars, and/or Chainlock invocations.

I believe these are the main non-numerical aspects I've seen. They are pretty broad, and ideally you'd like to always have one (or more!) of each in a given party, but you can't because there aren't enough PCs (in a four- or five-man party) to fill these roles and other, more stat-dependent roles like "ranged specialist" or "crowd control." So even if you roll up an array of all 3s, make a character that fills some or all of these aspects and you'll be making a valuable contribution, if you can bring yourself to roleplay a barely-sentient vegetable.

For example, I give you

JoeBob the Clerical Savant: senile, 120-year-old adventurer on his last legs, can barely think--but old reflexes die hard!

NG Human Trickery Cleric 7
Str 3 Dex 3 Con 3 Int 3 Wis 3 Cha 3 HP 24
Feats: Tough, Lucky
Skills: Stealthy, Perception, [some others]

JoeBob is barely sentient any more and will probably die any second now. He can barely even communicate, but he still (barely) remembers some old adventuring tricks which he can still use if somebody asks him. For example, if you tell him, "Hey, JoeBob, let's you and me play Mama Bear, okay?" he will twitch his fingers and cast Warding Bond on you, and then Polymorph himself into a T-Rex who follows you around trying to keep you safe via the Warding Bond and his loads of extra HP. If you tell him, "Hey, JoeBob, I need to be sneaky," he will bless you with the tricker's blessing (advantage), and if you ask him to come with you he will also cast Pass Without Trace and follow you around. (His total Stealth bonus under such conditions is +9, which is still respectable.)

He also has triggers for casting Bless, Dodging, casting Dispel Magic/Greater Restoration, healing wounds, and running away as fast as he can.

He shows little initiative and won't generally do anything outside of these predefined parameters (will not innovate tactically), except drool and stammer. Nevertheless he is surprisingly stringy and tough for such a frail-looking old man, and fate has so far smiled on him enough to keep him alive.

 

[BookBarbarian]

Welp. If I ever feeling like running a DMPC I now have a brilliant way to do it. I'd tip my hat to JoeBob, but he wouldn't understand the gesture, anyway.

 

[Satyrn]

Which leads to: do all of you lot who don't like random stats also de-randomize hit points?

While I prefer point, I don't dislike random stats.

I'm not sure if your question is directed at me.

 

[Sacrosanct]

That's a great example of how low stats can still be "good" and effective. However, on the other side, you can probably see where that wouldn't be all that fun to play from a player's perspective, if you were really limited in what you could do to a short predefined list because you weren't smart enough to think for yourself.

 

[FormerlyHemlock]

That's a great example of how low stats can still be "good" and effective. However, on the other side, you can probably see where that wouldn't be all that fun to play from a player's perspective, if you were really limited in what you could do to a short predefined list because you weren't smart enough to think for yourself.

Yeah, but that's a roleplaying choice, not a mechanical consequence of low stats. My anecdotal observation is that people who disliked rolled stats are generally unwilling to roleplay low Int anyway, so they'd probably just play JoeBob with his full tactical capabilities, which are considerable. (In fact, JoeBob is one of the few PCs you'll ever get to play who actually gets SMARTER when he Polymorphs into a Giant Ape and starts chucking rocks!)

But then again, they wouldn't be playing JoeBob in the first place at my table--they'd have just taken the standard array or point buy.

Anyway, I don't like roleplaying low Int generally, so I thought up JoeBob's senility/trigger-response pattern as my way of making him fun to play. I would enjoy playing JoeBob and mumbling cryptic things and stumbling around. I wouldn't enjoy doing so every session for years at a time, but there isn't any PC I'd enjoy playing every session for years at a time--variety is the spice of life, and that's what character trees are for.

 

[Lanefan]

While I prefer point, I don't dislike random stats.

I'm not sure if your question is directed at me.

Directed across the board, though I may have been quoting you in some preamble that led up to asking it.

 

[Lylandra]

Which leads to: do all of you lot who don't like random stats also de-randomize hit points?

I'm doing the opposite. I use de-randomized HP, but use rolled stats every now and then. But I try to let the player's stat arrays not drift too far from each other.

 

[TheNoremac42]

This is what I do when rolling a new character...

1d10 for Race (reroll on 10), 1d10+1d4 for Background (treat max on 1d10 as a 0). Do this six times, reroll to make sure they're all different combinations. Then roll a 1d6 to pick which one - or just pick the one that intrigues you the most. After that, roll 4d6-drop-lowest stats in order and then pick your class based on that. I got a pretty decent Wood Elf Sailor Bard with 17s in DEX and CHA (after racial mods) doing that.

I did once get a Tiefling Barbarian with the Scholar (Alchemy) background, so it's not exactly full proof... Definitely stretches your imagination muscles, though!