Why the beer hate? (Forked Thread: What are the no-goes...)

[Chainsaw]

You don't know how someone's going to behave under the influence until you see them under the influence. So, he should allow someone to ruin his time at least once as a drunken idiot before he takes action?

As for my opinion (I don't pretend to speak for anyone else here), he can do whatever he wants as a host (prohibiting whatever he wants, accepting whoever likes that ruleset) or as a player (only playing with people that agree with his rules). I would be irritated if someone new joined our group and waged some campaign to stop us all from having a beer or lectured us on why it was bad based on some bad experience he had. We'd kick the guy out.

These days I think people have trouble agreeing to disagree. He can have his standards, I can have mine. We can both think the other's are irrational, illogical, unacceptable, uninformed or simply not desirable. That's why we don't game together. We don't always need to resolve our differences or find some way to say "Oh, that's perfectly logical" even though we disagree.

This thread has gotten a little contentious at times because the nature of the subject matter makes it very tempting and easy to go beyond "agreeing to disagree" and try to give examples or logical arguments on why the other guy's standard is too harsh/wrong/bad for gaming, whatever.

Ultimately though, I think we can all agree that the game's great because it allows us to self-select a group of people that enjoy the same things we do, no?

 

[Wepwawet]

But when a lone man decides to draw the line at alcohol for his own reasons, then there's an argument, and some say he's behaving in a socially unacceptable manner? I'm not sure I get that. The guy's got a quirk. Big fat hairy deal!

For myself it was hard to understand why someone would have such strong feelings against a few beers (in my opinion inoffensive, when now and then), making him impose what appeared to be extreme and kinda arbitrary rules.
It took some of us (i.e., me) many many pages to understand his point of view because many of his posts were so vague and some times missing the point of the questions.
(That's how I see it, Bumbles, honest)

Obviously I respect his point of view. And we all saw there are as many perpectives as ENWorlders (and realworlders).

Although I see some similarities between us europeans

 

[Obryn]

So should I go with a certain brand of tobacco or just go straight to cigars? What about pipes? Would people think I'm cool smoking from a pipe while playing D&D (like a wizard)? A pipe might defeat the purpose

I used to smoke a pipe. It's actually pretty great and relaxing, and a fun social activity.

There's a pretty high cost of entry if you go for a burl pipe, but it's cheap if you start on a corncob. (Seriously - they're pretty good pipes!) You definitely need pipe cleaners. But after that, the pipe tobacco is very, very inexpensive.

Also, it smells pretty wonderful. (Damn, now I need to head down to the tobacconist and break out my pipe!)

I also smoked a few hookahs in my time - again, tobacco, not pot. Now THERE is a heck of a wonderful experience, with all the lovely flavors and the nice, cool smoke. The entry barrier for that is quite a bit higher, though. Still, I could see gaming while smoking from a table hookah.

-O

 

[Obryn]

The more interesting part of this thread, to me, is not why people might disallow alcohol, but instead how folks react to that disallowance.

I think there are different reactions depending on the reasons, to be honest.

My primary rule is that I'll always be respectful of a game's host. If the host bans alcohol for whatever reason, that's their call and it's not my place to question it.

If someone refuses to game with a group because someone in the group might be drinking, not to excess... I find that a little weird, and I like to hear reasons. Having been around plenty of drunk people, and being pretty aware of the gulf between "had a beer," "buzzed," "drunk," and "blackout" ... I honestly don't understand why someone would object to someone else drinking a beer in their presence. So I like to try and understand. I still don't though, in this case.

-O

 

[Morrus]

But when a lone man decides to draw the line at alcohol for his own reasons, then there's an argument, and some say he's behaving in a socially unacceptable manner? I'm not sure I get that. The guy's got a quirk. Big fat hairy deal!

I think you misunderstand that. I wasn't claiming there's a universal stadard of social acceptability; I was merely saying that, for me, I would find it very difficult having any kind of social relationship with a person who lumped me in with problematic individuals just because it's more ocnvenient for him to avoid confrontation with those peope.

As I said -I, myself, would prefer to deal with a problematic individual if/when the situation arises.

And, obviously, he has the right to set whatever rules he likes in his own home. I can't imagine anybody is disputing that for a second. If he says we have to wear pink fluffy hats in his house, then we have to wear pink fluffy hats in his house.

 

[ExploderWizard]

I think you misunderstand that. I wasn't claiming there's a universal stadard of social acceptability; I was merely saying that, for me, I would find it very difficult having any kind of social relationship with a person who lumped me in with problematic individuals just because it's more ocnvenient for him to avoid confrontation with those peope.

As I said -I, myself, would prefer to deal with a problematic individual if/when the situation arises.

And, obviously, he has the right to set whatever rules he likes in his own home. I can't imagine anybody is disputing that for a second. If he says we have to wear pink fluffy hats in his house, then we have to wear pink fluffy hats in his house.

OK. Are you drunk?

 

[Chainsaw]

Good thing he's the host and can make the rules about posting while drinking!

 

[Desdichado]

Sorry, but it's not that common to have that kind of reaction if someone has smoked outside and then later enters the room. Most people do not even know you have smoked unless they get very close to you.

Agree with the first sentence. Disagree with the second. Just because people don't complain doesn't mean they don't notice. They're just too polite to say, "dude, you REEK!"

 

[maddman75]

It might be really interesting to start a poll on the drinking attitude as compared to country. I suspect that a higher percentage of folks in the US will have a problem with it, but I don't know for sure.

It will vary considerably.

I and most of my friends come from a working class midwestern culture, which alcohol is very much a part of. It is a social glue that brings people together. I have to remember that not everyone will realize this, but having a beer is one of the primary ways people here socialize. It would be the height of rudeness to ask someone not to drink beer in their own house. Conversely, for them not to offer you one of their beers even if you've just met would also be rude. Most of the time if I'm meeting someone new I'll accept just a beer just to be sociable, even if its a brand I despise.

Now most people are accepting if someone doesn't want to drink a beer, though there's often a moment of making sure that this isn't because the one offering hasn't offended the person in some way. A cursory explaination will take care of it, such as 'my Dad was an alcoholic' or 'its against my religion'. But the default assumption is the social message "I'm not going to drink a beer with you because I'm not your friend."

This makes the militant anti-drinkers look very odd and outcast from where I'm standing. Though with the people they game with I would likely be the one on the outside for popping open a beer, asking them if they wanted any, and upon refusal telling them the different brands I have or offering to make a mixed drink out of the liqour cabinet.

Yep. My village is also a dry one. And I have voted for it to remain so twice.

Not to get political, but you do realize that dry counties have higher rates of underage drinking and DUI, right?

 

[Bumbles]

But when a lone man decides to draw the line at alcohol for his own reasons, then there's an argument, and some say he's behaving in a socially unacceptable manner? I'm not sure I get that. The guy's got a quirk. Big fat hairy deal!

Oh, I'm not alone. I know that. There are people who want to make that the argument, but not only is it an inappropriate type of argument trying to use the group consensus to coerce the individual, it's a false one. There's plenty of people who have chimed in to say they share the same reasoning.

It may be a quirk, perhaps, but then, I think drinking is as much of one. If it's not worse, when it becomes a disease. Which I suppose could happen to my "quirk" at some point, but until I do something like start breaking into Saloon Halls to smash them up with an axe or nominating myself to be the Prohibition Party's candidate for President, I don't think it represents such. Any more than I think because somebody refuses to play at a game of mine where I don't allow something they prefer.

The more interesting part of this thread, to me, is not why people might disallow alcohol, but instead how folks react to that disallowance.

This I agree with completely.