Psyzhran2357
First Post
Nothing for 5e as far as I can tell, at least not in the core books. Which is the very topic of this thread: how haphazardly and poorly implemented the metal restriction is in 5e.
D&D 5E (2014) Why the Druid Metal Restriction is Poorly Implemented
- Thread starter Ohmyn
- Start date
Nothing for 5e as far as I can tell, at least not in the core books. Which is the very topic of this thread: how haphazardly and poorly implemented the metal restriction is in 5e.
Sacrosanct
Legend
Interesting analogy. One that actually proves a point, just the opposite of what you think. Laicization is the process of which a catholic priest loses all of their Uber god powerz. They are no longer a priest. RAW (to use D&D terms), any priest who marries or has sex will go through that process. It has not been followed through in some cases, but that doesn’t change how that’s the rule and process. Just like how if your gaming table won’t de-Druid a Druid who wears armor, that doesn’t change the fact that the rule is clear.
L
lowkey13
Guest
*Deleted by user*
Paul Farquhar
Legend
In catholic teaching recent rulings override older ones. And the church has long taught that a priest who breaks their vows but repents is forgiven. In fact, it has often gone the other way (largely due to a shortage of priests), a priest who completely rejects the church, marries and has a family remains, in the eyes of the Church a priest. They cannot choose to stop being a priest no matter what they do.
Of course, if you rule that a character who is no called a druid cannot have the powers of a druid, then it clearly follows that a character who is not a Japanese noble cannot be a Samurai.
Psyzhran2357
First Post
matsifYesterday at 11:19 AM
the metal stuff for druids should be ignored. the celts were great bronze workers and the druid is mostly based on them, the whole "no metal" thing is silly at best.
Christ AvelloneYesterday at 11:20 AM
the celts invented chainmail
eerongalYesterday at 11:20 AM
pfft, as if i'd allow historical accuracy to taint my D&D game
NumbugYesterday at 11:20 AM
And who said metal is unnatural?
Red Rick DiasYesterday at 11:21 AM
The celts didn't invent chainmail, your momma did! The celts is THE DEVIL!
Hmm... would this make Bobby Boucher a Cleric of Momma until he class-changes into a Paladin of Vengeance later on?
matsifYesterday at 11:22 AM
the whole idea of "but no metal" when they are proficient in scimitars is a bit hypocritical to me as well if you ignore the "historical accuracy" things
NumbugYesterday at 11:22 AM
When looking at the d&d Druid you should definitely be thinking about it in terms of modern druidity, which is a lot more explicit about the whole nature thing
and even then, metal is a natural thing :U
ConstructmanYesterday at 11:22 AM
Like Neopagan stuff?
NumbugYesterday at 11:22 AM
So in terms of realism, it's a completely arbitrary restriction
matsifYesterday at 11:23 AM
especially when folks end up doing things like "well here's ironwood that does the same thing as metal for the sake of armor but isn't metal so you can actually have an AC"
RedYesterday at 11:23 AM
"modern druidity"
Red Rick DiasYesterday at 11:23 AM
I remember an old WOTC mini, the Greenfang Druid.
Which wore wood all over, but had a metal scimitar in hand.
eerongalYesterday at 11:23 AM
i think its more the idea of metal working being "unnatural" than metal itself being "unnatural"
NumbugYesterday at 11:23 AM
It got revived
I think it's niche?
But yeah
eerongalYesterday at 11:23 AM
though, doesnt apply to weapons for whatever reason
ConstructmanYesterday at 11:24 AM
Wicca I've heard of
as well as general Neopaganism
modern Druidism escaped my notice though
eerongalYesterday at 11:25 AM
in AD&D, the reason for not wearing metal armor was because it basically "cut them off" from their magic
like a barrier to it
in 5e, its basically a flavor hold over
ConstructmanYesterday at 11:27 AM
Meanwhile, Spore Druids are crying because unless you're a Warforged or a Tortle or a Loxodon, your AC is
, so you'll get chewed up if you go into melee, but you need to go into melee to use your subclass features, and blargh...
matsifYesterday at 11:27 AM
yeah and paladins and bards and monks and druids used to have alignment restrictions from "flavor holdover." it's generally a nonsensical flavor limitation that people believe is a requirement because of where it is placed in the PHB that should be removed.
ConstructmanYesterday at 11:28 AM
It would work so much better if it was in the class introductory prelude
or better yet, in a grey sidebar
but not in the proficiencies list ffs
matsifYesterday at 11:29 AM
druid already has a perfect spot for it
"sacred woods and plants"
greenbox aside
but instead it's part of proficiencies so people take it as direct RAW, and then someone wants to play a druid that actually uses that medium armor proficiency and the DM ends up making "ironwood" or [insert carapace or chitin or other material] half plate so that the druid can circumvent that, at which point why even have the restriction
eerongalYesterday at 11:31 AM
i mean, its been clearly stated by WotC that druids explode if they put on metal armor(edited)
ConstructmanYesterday at 11:32 AM
They deal 15d8 thunder damage when they explode
in a 30 foot radius
PraxisYesterday at 11:32 AM
I feel like 5e has a bunch of things like that - restrictions or rules that exist for flavour but are placed in a way that sometimes give the impression they exist for balance reasons
matsifYesterday at 11:35 AM
people take the racial limitations on the SCAG subclasses that have them as direct RAW even though it says right in the limitation that the DM can ignore it
PraxisYesterday at 11:37 AM
same with backgrounds - they're very customizable RAW but plenty of people see an enumerated list and assume it's meant to cover all the available options
Christ AvelloneYesterday at 11:40 AM
I'd fix it by restricting druids to light armor (and maybe hide) but give them an armor bonus for wearing armor made out of animal or plant material
eerongalYesterday at 11:40 AM
that's actually a pretty good idea
give like a +2 AC for wearing armors made of cloth/leather/animal/plant stuffs
it helps encourage wearing "natural" armors
matsifYesterday at 11:41 AM
I just don't see the point of having the restriction to begin with if you're going to allow them to use metal in their weapons still
eerongalYesterday at 11:41 AM
or maybe even make it like an "unarmored defense" type thing
Christ AvelloneYesterday at 11:42 AM
because metal doesn't touch their body
matsifYesterday at 11:42 AM
if the culture is forging metal weapons then you're making a lot of logical jumps to think no one in the druid's culture would attempt to make metal armor
ConstructmanYesterday at 11:42 AM
Might be a sympathetic magic thing
eerongalYesterday at 11:42 AM
something like "when wearing armor made of plant/animal material you can instead use 10 + dex + wis for your AC"
ConstructmanYesterday at 11:42 AM
like a crescent is a holy symbol
Christ AvelloneYesterday at 11:42 AM
nah that'd give them the highest AC ever
morikahnYesterday at 11:43 AM
i think the restirction on druids using metal equipment is less about the material and its ties to civilization
ConstructmanYesterday at 11:43 AM
or it might be a feng shui thing, except on your body...???
but again
Christ AvelloneYesterday at 11:43 AM
they'd have like 25 AC with a shield
ConstructmanYesterday at 11:43 AM
that requires ACTUALLY EXPLAINING IT(edited)
morikahnYesterday at 11:43 AM
worked metal is a sign of an advanced civilization
Christ AvelloneYesterday at 11:43 AM
Anyway the reason druids can use metal weapons is because they need to be able to harvest sacred herbs for their rituals
ConstructmanYesterday at 11:43 AM
Stone knife: am I a joke to you?
Christ AvelloneYesterday at 11:43 AM
that's why they have scimitar proficiency: in 1e there was no "sickle" weapon and the scimitar was the closest to a druidic sickle
you try harvesting with a stone knife
you're more likely to crush your crop than slice it
matsifYesterday at 11:44 AM
I guess obsidian isn't real
the metal stuff for druids should be ignored. the celts were great bronze workers and the druid is mostly based on them, the whole "no metal" thing is silly at best.
Christ AvelloneYesterday at 11:20 AM
the celts invented chainmail
eerongalYesterday at 11:20 AM
pfft, as if i'd allow historical accuracy to taint my D&D game
NumbugYesterday at 11:20 AM
And who said metal is unnatural?
Red Rick DiasYesterday at 11:21 AM
The celts didn't invent chainmail, your momma did! The celts is THE DEVIL!
Hmm... would this make Bobby Boucher a Cleric of Momma until he class-changes into a Paladin of Vengeance later on?
matsifYesterday at 11:22 AM
the whole idea of "but no metal" when they are proficient in scimitars is a bit hypocritical to me as well if you ignore the "historical accuracy" things
NumbugYesterday at 11:22 AM
When looking at the d&d Druid you should definitely be thinking about it in terms of modern druidity, which is a lot more explicit about the whole nature thing
and even then, metal is a natural thing :U
ConstructmanYesterday at 11:22 AM
Like Neopagan stuff?
NumbugYesterday at 11:22 AM
So in terms of realism, it's a completely arbitrary restriction
matsifYesterday at 11:23 AM
especially when folks end up doing things like "well here's ironwood that does the same thing as metal for the sake of armor but isn't metal so you can actually have an AC"
RedYesterday at 11:23 AM
"modern druidity"
Red Rick DiasYesterday at 11:23 AM
I remember an old WOTC mini, the Greenfang Druid.
Which wore wood all over, but had a metal scimitar in hand.
eerongalYesterday at 11:23 AM
i think its more the idea of metal working being "unnatural" than metal itself being "unnatural"
NumbugYesterday at 11:23 AM
It got revived
I think it's niche?
But yeah
eerongalYesterday at 11:23 AM
though, doesnt apply to weapons for whatever reason
ConstructmanYesterday at 11:24 AM
Wicca I've heard of
as well as general Neopaganism
modern Druidism escaped my notice though
eerongalYesterday at 11:25 AM
in AD&D, the reason for not wearing metal armor was because it basically "cut them off" from their magic
like a barrier to it
in 5e, its basically a flavor hold over
ConstructmanYesterday at 11:27 AM
Meanwhile, Spore Druids are crying because unless you're a Warforged or a Tortle or a Loxodon, your AC is
, so you'll get chewed up if you go into melee, but you need to go into melee to use your subclass features, and blargh...matsifYesterday at 11:27 AM
yeah and paladins and bards and monks and druids used to have alignment restrictions from "flavor holdover." it's generally a nonsensical flavor limitation that people believe is a requirement because of where it is placed in the PHB that should be removed.
ConstructmanYesterday at 11:28 AM
It would work so much better if it was in the class introductory prelude
or better yet, in a grey sidebar
but not in the proficiencies list ffs
matsifYesterday at 11:29 AM
druid already has a perfect spot for it
"sacred woods and plants"
greenbox aside
but instead it's part of proficiencies so people take it as direct RAW, and then someone wants to play a druid that actually uses that medium armor proficiency and the DM ends up making "ironwood" or [insert carapace or chitin or other material] half plate so that the druid can circumvent that, at which point why even have the restriction
eerongalYesterday at 11:31 AM
i mean, its been clearly stated by WotC that druids explode if they put on metal armor(edited)
ConstructmanYesterday at 11:32 AM
They deal 15d8 thunder damage when they explode
in a 30 foot radius
PraxisYesterday at 11:32 AM
I feel like 5e has a bunch of things like that - restrictions or rules that exist for flavour but are placed in a way that sometimes give the impression they exist for balance reasons
matsifYesterday at 11:35 AM
people take the racial limitations on the SCAG subclasses that have them as direct RAW even though it says right in the limitation that the DM can ignore it
PraxisYesterday at 11:37 AM
same with backgrounds - they're very customizable RAW but plenty of people see an enumerated list and assume it's meant to cover all the available options
Christ AvelloneYesterday at 11:40 AM
I'd fix it by restricting druids to light armor (and maybe hide) but give them an armor bonus for wearing armor made out of animal or plant material
eerongalYesterday at 11:40 AM
that's actually a pretty good idea
give like a +2 AC for wearing armors made of cloth/leather/animal/plant stuffs
it helps encourage wearing "natural" armors
matsifYesterday at 11:41 AM
I just don't see the point of having the restriction to begin with if you're going to allow them to use metal in their weapons still
eerongalYesterday at 11:41 AM
or maybe even make it like an "unarmored defense" type thing
Christ AvelloneYesterday at 11:42 AM
because metal doesn't touch their body
matsifYesterday at 11:42 AM
if the culture is forging metal weapons then you're making a lot of logical jumps to think no one in the druid's culture would attempt to make metal armor
ConstructmanYesterday at 11:42 AM
Might be a sympathetic magic thing
eerongalYesterday at 11:42 AM
something like "when wearing armor made of plant/animal material you can instead use 10 + dex + wis for your AC"
ConstructmanYesterday at 11:42 AM
like a crescent is a holy symbol
Christ AvelloneYesterday at 11:42 AM
nah that'd give them the highest AC ever
morikahnYesterday at 11:43 AM
i think the restirction on druids using metal equipment is less about the material and its ties to civilization
ConstructmanYesterday at 11:43 AM
or it might be a feng shui thing, except on your body...???
but again
Christ AvelloneYesterday at 11:43 AM
they'd have like 25 AC with a shield
ConstructmanYesterday at 11:43 AM
that requires ACTUALLY EXPLAINING IT(edited)
morikahnYesterday at 11:43 AM
worked metal is a sign of an advanced civilization
Christ AvelloneYesterday at 11:43 AM
Anyway the reason druids can use metal weapons is because they need to be able to harvest sacred herbs for their rituals
ConstructmanYesterday at 11:43 AM
Stone knife: am I a joke to you?
Christ AvelloneYesterday at 11:43 AM
that's why they have scimitar proficiency: in 1e there was no "sickle" weapon and the scimitar was the closest to a druidic sickle
you try harvesting with a stone knife
you're more likely to crush your crop than slice it
matsifYesterday at 11:44 AM
I guess obsidian isn't real
Sacrosanct
Legend
It’s there, and has been pointed out. This whole “opinion =/= facts” thing appears to be throwing you for a loop.
Psyzhran2357
First Post
That works on principle I guess, if they chose to commit to it on a mechanical level. As it stands, it's a lore holdover, but since lore is setting dependent, it's just... wearesgtrhdshdsgehrdnthswe5ythrtdyrhewy5htsrdnhsasehtnrdgthsaehtngrdxhsaewtrd
I'm just salty about Spore Druids because WHY DESIGN A GISH SUBCLASS IF THEY DON'T HAVE THE DEFENSES NECESSARY TO STAY ALIVE WHILE GISHING GIVE ME MY MUSHROOM SNORTING ZOMBIE RAISING GOLGARI HIPPY WITH ACTUAL DECENT AC PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE
Sacrosanct
Legend
Nope. It’s a rule that if you get married or have sex, you go through Laicization. And it’s followed more often than not. Laicization Is also often done per the priests choice (like when they want to get married). So you’re wrong on that as well.
Me, raised Roman Catholic...
L
lowkey13
Guest
*Deleted by user*
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