Why there's crafting in WOW and not in D&D

[Staffan]

Forked from: Just played my first 4E game

It's kind of sad when limited computer games have a more robust and more flexible crafting system than D&D. And reducing everything relevant to magic is even sadder.

The reason you can have a "more robust and flexible" crafting system in WoW than in D&D is that the WoW system is centered around grinding materials.
For example, in order to make a Thorium Rifle, you need:

• 2 Mithril Tubes
  • 6 Mithril Bars
    • 6 Mithril Ore
• 2 Mithril Casings
  • 6 Mithril Bars
    • 6 Mithril Ore
• 2 Thorium Widgets
  • 6 Thorium Bars
    • 6 Thorium Ore
  • 2 Runecloth
• 4 Thorium Bars
  • 4 Thorium Ore
• 1 Deadly Scope
  • 1 Mithril Tube
    • 3 Mithil Bars
      • 3 Mithril Ore
  • 2 Aquamarines
  • 2 Thick leather

That is, the raw materials total:

• 15 Mithril ore
• 10 Thorium ore
• 2 Runecloth
• 2 Aquamarines
• 2 Thick Leather

Getting that material requires spending a lot of time in-game running around mining nodes (for the ores and gems), killing people in order to get cloth, and skinning animals to get the leather. Some of that can be deferred to others (by buying stuff at the auction house), but that just means someone else invested that time.

That whole grinding thing doesn't really exist in D&D, or in most other RPGs for that matter (I remember that Rolemaster had rules for locating herbs though). And that's why you can't have a WoW-esque crafting system in D&D.

 

[Fenes]

I was not thinking about WoW, but about SWG. With an in game economy, you simply buy your raw materials from miners, trappers, etc.

That would be possible in D&D as well - add a price list, and add some crafting. You don't have to have PCs gather the materials at all, that can be done by NPCs, aka DM fiat.

(And we have a crafting system in 3E, so it is possible.)

 

[Wormwood]

Yes, but WoW crafting generally concerns itself with items that are useful at roughly your level of play.

D&D Craft Skills tend to be about mighty heroes who can make iron pots and 1st-level armor.

 

[ExploderWizard]

Yes, but WoW crafting generally concerns itself with items that are useful at roughly your level of play.

D&D Craft Skills tend to be about mighty heroes who can make iron pots and 1st-level armor.

For basic craft skills yes. Item creation feats let you craft stuff that is more level appropriate.

 

[Wormwood]

For basic craft skills yes. Item creation feats let you craft stuff that is more level appropriate.

Yes, but Item Creation is so incredibly simple and streamlined in 4e that I assumed we were talking about craft skills. Or verismilitude. Or something.

 

[C.W.Richeson]

MMOs use crafting systems to extend the play experience. In fact, a great many of their features incorporate ways to delay players from reaching the 'end' and thereby increasing revenue.

Plenty of RPGs have systems for creating goods, from gadgets (Spirit of teh Century) to simple book items (D&D 3.0).

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

MMOs use crafting systems to extend the play experience. In fact, a great many of their features incorporate ways to delay players from reaching the 'end' and thereby increasing revenue.

EverQuest II and Horizons even made crafting, at least initially, a theoretically fully viable way to play the game in lieu of being an adventurer. Late in its life, Ultima Online advertised the ability to be a medieval baker on the package, aiming the game at the "fantasy sim" crowd (which was good, since the overall gaming world was kind of hosed from all sorts of unintended effects of earlier parts of the game).

I'm confident we're going to see multiple optional crafting systems for 4E, both from WotC and third party publishers, for the people who like that.

Honestly, to me, a bigger issue in D&D is that the game never had drinking rules, despite the cliche of everyone spending every waking moment in taverns, like well-armed extras from Cheers.

 

[Boarstorm]

"Vellis the Bold? You are him, are you not? The wizard who single-handedly slew the tribe of hobgoblins up near Keldan Ridge?"
"I am."
"Sir, I come to you on behalf of the peaceful villagers of Hommlet who have a problem quite dire. It seems that cultists of a bizarre elemental deity have --"
"Sorry, can't."
"Pardon?"
"Working on my blacksmithing. I need to make another 19 of these iron longswords to get a skillup, which means I'm going to have to head up into the mountains for a few weeks to gather the ore."
"I'm certain the good people of Hommlet would reward you with all the iron you could want in exchange for driving off--"
"Nah. In another two skillups I'm going to need adamantite anyway."
"They'll happily build you a workshop, good sir, and the town would be overjoyed to have a powerful wizard in residence to help defend against--"
"Workshop? Pssshaw. See that pile of hot coals over there? And that anvil? That's all I need."
"But that belongs to--"
"He doesn't mind."
"Sir, please, without your aid--"
"Hey, go bother Roth. He's a skinner, he might need to kill the local sheep or something."
"But... but..."
You are now being ignored by Vellis.

 

[Tervin]

Honestly, to me, a bigger issue in D&D is that the game never had drinking rules, despite the cliche of everyone spending every waking moment in taverns, like well-armed extras from Cheers.

My weird old memory frowned and spoke to me of drinking rules in the AD&D 1 DMG. And what do you know! On pages 82-83 you find "EFFECTS OF ALCOHOL AND DRUGS". Very far from the best rules I have seen in an a game though. Basically it could be a very good way to keep your henchmen from running away...

 

[Brennin Magalus]

4E IS NOT A VIDEO GAME!!! I four won dont understand how people can think this one is played on the computer and the other played at the table!!!