FrogReaver
The most respectful and polite poster ever
The Answer
I'd rather be interesting than right.
A common question is whether Wizards or Sorcerers are better. This must be because Wizards and Sorcerers are so very similar. The true answer is that it depends on the campaign and the character level and progression range being analyzed. Yet, there's so much more we can say. It's just not going to be universal. There will be plenty of times when what's typically better will be worse. Part of my goal is to examine not just which class is better but when it is better.
TLDR
Charisma vs Intelligence Skills
He's so dumb he could talk his way out of anything.
When it comes to Charisma skills, they are soo open ended that they are almost always potentially useful. That said, there's a few classes that can easily be better or just as good at charisma skills as the sorcerer and most of those classes are also very good (Bard, Paladin, Warlock, Rogue and even Battlemaster Fighter). The nature of Charisma skills means it's not common to get multiple attempts to persuade an NPC to do something, so it's usually whoever has the highest Bonus, though not always.
On the other hand, Wizards are the Intelligence class. However, Druids and Clerics can use opt into the ability to use Wisdom for arcana/nature or arcana/religion. Intelligent Rogues can take a number of intelligence skills and expertise in them and at least match if not eventually outperform the Wizard. In short, there's a bit of competition for Wizards on Intelligence skills as well. Wizards will typically be best at one of the skills due to getting expertise in one of them and desiring high intelligence. Perhaps more importantly intelligence skills can typically be used by multiple party members for the same goal. This tends to make any one players bonuses less important.
On playstyle
Charisma skills boost what I would consider to be a tactical maneuver whereas Intelligence skills granting information tend to form the basis for long term strategic plans. Tactics vs Strategy.
Which Wins When
Constitution vs Wisdom Saves
The mind is greater than the body... Says no construction worker ever!
If you'd asked my thoughts on this back in early 2014 I'd have said Constitution for sure. They help concentration saves and they still often carry some fairly rough effects often along with high damage. Contrary to popular belief, damage does matter quite a bit to Tier 1 and Early Tier 2 Wizards and Sorcerers.
That said, a level 1 healing word can solve the 0 hp condition. It's a bit harder to stop a hold person or similar. As such I think that while the Constitution saves that Sorcerers have proficiency in come up a bit more often, that the effects wisdom saves prevent are more often worse.
Which Wins When
IMO. When it comes to Constitution or Wisdom saves It's a tie, though if forced i'd give wisdom an ever so slight edge. One of the worst TPK's we ever had was our Paladin was dominated and forced to smite the rest of us to death.
Origins
Give me Magic Initiate or give me Death!
Unlike men, not all origins are created equal. Conventional wisdom suggest that a Sorcerer should desire Charisma, Dexterity and Constitution and a Wizard should desire Intelligence, Dexterity and Constitution. When looking at non-custom backgrounds,
Sorcerer Top 3
Which Wins When
I had came into this thinking Wizard with Sage would have a slight advantage. However, on careful consideration I'd actually give this to the Entertainer Sorcerer. Heroic Inspiration can be more front loaded into combats and just as impactful as any first level spell. That it comes back on a short rest also makes it excellent for skill check buffing. I think Sage's Magic Initiate can make a case for level 1 or 2 when spell slots and spells known are generally really low and it's skills are generally more useful. Maybe if it was Magic Initiate Cleric or Druid, that Sage granted, but Magic Initiate Wizard just isn't enough.
Species
Can the different species interbreed? Asking for a friend.
Overall early game Sorcerers tend to have more weaknesses than Wizards (fewer spells to cover fewer situations, though this tends to be remedied by level 3 subclasses). To me that means the Sorcerers choice of species will have bigger gaps it can fill, meaning the choice probably helps the sorcerer more than the Wizard at least in the early game. I don't have much else to say, but I do kind of like how a gnome sorcerer can give you advantage in wis, cha, int saves and gets constitution saves. That covers alot of defensive bases.
Which Wins When
I can't really say that the Sorcerer wins here when the reason I said Species mattered more early weaknesses due to a smaller spell list early. Thus, I'd rate this a complete tie in basically every situation.
Rituals vs Metamagic
The single largest defining difference.
I really should say Metamagic and Innate Sorcery vs Rituals and Arcane Recovery. With this we come full circle back to the most common theme, tactical options and combat efficiency goes to the sorcerer, out of combat strategic exploration and information gathering abilities goes to the Wizard.
Which Wins When
Which is better strictly depends on the campaign, but I think most campaigns typically favor tactical options and combat efficiency.
Spell List and Known/Prepared
Siri Repeat. Hit me baby one more time.
I'm not going to say much more. Wizards have a better spell list, though they don't really get more spells prepared after Sorcerer subclass spells are factored in. They have much better level 6+ spells. They do get enough to add quite a few rituals to their spell book along with a few context dependent spells they can swap out. Depending on level this may actually be as much of a difference as Metamagic, but for lower levels it's generally not that much more power. Most of the best low level spells are on both the Wizard and Sorcerer lists, essentially meaning the wizard might get to pick up a better 4th or 5th top spell than the Sorcerer. It's a bigger difference on paper than it is in practice, though as more splat books come out this could easily change into a huge advantage.
Which Wins When
Wizard here always, but not by a country mile.
Merry Christmas @Snarf Zagyg
I'd rather be interesting than right.
A common question is whether Wizards or Sorcerers are better. This must be because Wizards and Sorcerers are so very similar. The true answer is that it depends on the campaign and the character level and progression range being analyzed. Yet, there's so much more we can say. It's just not going to be universal. There will be plenty of times when what's typically better will be worse. Part of my goal is to examine not just which class is better but when it is better.
TLDR
- Sorcerer is best if no other Charisma classes are in the party and when Combat and Tactics matters more than Exploration and Strategy.
- Wizard is best when Exploration and Strategy matters more and when there's already a Charisma class present in the party.
- Most campaigns probably are more about combat tactics than Strategy so Sorcerer probably wins out in more campaigns, but Wizard will do better in plenty as well.
Charisma vs Intelligence Skills
He's so dumb he could talk his way out of anything.
When it comes to Charisma skills, they are soo open ended that they are almost always potentially useful. That said, there's a few classes that can easily be better or just as good at charisma skills as the sorcerer and most of those classes are also very good (Bard, Paladin, Warlock, Rogue and even Battlemaster Fighter). The nature of Charisma skills means it's not common to get multiple attempts to persuade an NPC to do something, so it's usually whoever has the highest Bonus, though not always.
On the other hand, Wizards are the Intelligence class. However, Druids and Clerics can use opt into the ability to use Wisdom for arcana/nature or arcana/religion. Intelligent Rogues can take a number of intelligence skills and expertise in them and at least match if not eventually outperform the Wizard. In short, there's a bit of competition for Wizards on Intelligence skills as well. Wizards will typically be best at one of the skills due to getting expertise in one of them and desiring high intelligence. Perhaps more importantly intelligence skills can typically be used by multiple party members for the same goal. This tends to make any one players bonuses less important.
On playstyle
Charisma skills boost what I would consider to be a tactical maneuver whereas Intelligence skills granting information tend to form the basis for long term strategic plans. Tactics vs Strategy.
Which Wins When
- The Sorcerer Charisma skill focus tends to win out when there are no other Charisma classes in the party.
- The Wizards Intelligence skill focus tends to be better when there is already a charisma focused party member or when information from checks can be used to make important long term strategical plans that matter. You usually need a very inquisitive player for this to really start mattering.
- If party makeup is unknown I'd give Wizard Intelligence skills a slight edge, just because I'm sure they'll be useful at least some of the time, whereas with a bard/warlock/paladin in the party, the sorcerer probably isn't best or not significantly better at any of the Charisma skills.
Constitution vs Wisdom Saves
The mind is greater than the body... Says no construction worker ever!
If you'd asked my thoughts on this back in early 2014 I'd have said Constitution for sure. They help concentration saves and they still often carry some fairly rough effects often along with high damage. Contrary to popular belief, damage does matter quite a bit to Tier 1 and Early Tier 2 Wizards and Sorcerers.
That said, a level 1 healing word can solve the 0 hp condition. It's a bit harder to stop a hold person or similar. As such I think that while the Constitution saves that Sorcerers have proficiency in come up a bit more often, that the effects wisdom saves prevent are more often worse.
Which Wins When
IMO. When it comes to Constitution or Wisdom saves It's a tie, though if forced i'd give wisdom an ever so slight edge. One of the worst TPK's we ever had was our Paladin was dominated and forced to smite the rest of us to death.
Origins
Give me Magic Initiate or give me Death!
Unlike men, not all origins are created equal. Conventional wisdom suggest that a Sorcerer should desire Charisma, Dexterity and Constitution and a Wizard should desire Intelligence, Dexterity and Constitution. When looking at non-custom backgrounds,
Sorcerer Top 3
- Entertainer (Musician) (Cha, Dex)
- Wayfarer (Lucky) (Cha, Dex)
- Acolyte (Magic Initiate Cleric) (Cha)
- Sage (Magic Initiate Wizard) (Int, Con)
- Criminal (Alert) (Int, Dex, Con)
- Acolyte (Magic Initiate Cleric) (Int)
Which Wins When
I had came into this thinking Wizard with Sage would have a slight advantage. However, on careful consideration I'd actually give this to the Entertainer Sorcerer. Heroic Inspiration can be more front loaded into combats and just as impactful as any first level spell. That it comes back on a short rest also makes it excellent for skill check buffing. I think Sage's Magic Initiate can make a case for level 1 or 2 when spell slots and spells known are generally really low and it's skills are generally more useful. Maybe if it was Magic Initiate Cleric or Druid, that Sage granted, but Magic Initiate Wizard just isn't enough.
Species
Can the different species interbreed? Asking for a friend.
Overall early game Sorcerers tend to have more weaknesses than Wizards (fewer spells to cover fewer situations, though this tends to be remedied by level 3 subclasses). To me that means the Sorcerers choice of species will have bigger gaps it can fill, meaning the choice probably helps the sorcerer more than the Wizard at least in the early game. I don't have much else to say, but I do kind of like how a gnome sorcerer can give you advantage in wis, cha, int saves and gets constitution saves. That covers alot of defensive bases.
Which Wins When
I can't really say that the Sorcerer wins here when the reason I said Species mattered more early weaknesses due to a smaller spell list early. Thus, I'd rate this a complete tie in basically every situation.
Rituals vs Metamagic
The single largest defining difference.
I really should say Metamagic and Innate Sorcery vs Rituals and Arcane Recovery. With this we come full circle back to the most common theme, tactical options and combat efficiency goes to the sorcerer, out of combat strategic exploration and information gathering abilities goes to the Wizard.
Which Wins When
Which is better strictly depends on the campaign, but I think most campaigns typically favor tactical options and combat efficiency.
Spell List and Known/Prepared
Siri Repeat. Hit me baby one more time.
I'm not going to say much more. Wizards have a better spell list, though they don't really get more spells prepared after Sorcerer subclass spells are factored in. They have much better level 6+ spells. They do get enough to add quite a few rituals to their spell book along with a few context dependent spells they can swap out. Depending on level this may actually be as much of a difference as Metamagic, but for lower levels it's generally not that much more power. Most of the best low level spells are on both the Wizard and Sorcerer lists, essentially meaning the wizard might get to pick up a better 4th or 5th top spell than the Sorcerer. It's a bigger difference on paper than it is in practice, though as more splat books come out this could easily change into a huge advantage.
Which Wins When
Wizard here always, but not by a country mile.
Merry Christmas @Snarf Zagyg
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