WotC may have sent the Pinkertons to a magic leakers home. Update: WotC confirms it and has a response.

[Mannahnin]

They're always armed in the field as I understand it, unless they literally can't be and they're literally employed to prevent unionization and intimidate strikers. I'm not sure what more you want. They're hired because their name and history are intimidating.

Why would they always be armed? What is that "as I understand it" understanding based on?

The one source I've seen cited for them and potential anti-union activities at Amazon talks about documents showing that they were used to investigate a warehouse in Poland to determine if workers were circumventing the application process for working there.

I completely get why folks are concerned about Amazon and union-busting. I just haven't seen much fire for all the smoke that's blowing in here. A bit of Googling turns up a few popular articles but the only substantive recent acts they all seem to point to are that investigation in the Polish warehouse and providing security in West Virginia during part of a Frontier Communications strike, but I'm not seeing any reports of violence from them connected to that.

 

[Mannahnin]

Right here in the article posted just upthread.

The Pinkertons Still Never Sleep

The notorious union-busting agency has resurfaced in a telecommunications labor dispute, revealing how it has adapted to the 21st century.

newrepublic.com

Yeah, I read that one. It doesn't support that accusation.

 

[Ruin Explorer]

Putting the ethics and legality of the situation to one side, was this a good decision by wotc from a PR perspective? Knowing their audience, knowing the way twitter/youtube works, being mindful of recent history...has it been beneficial to them as a company?

Yeah that's the key point imho.

Everything else is a bit of fun distraction. The reality is, this was a really stupid, ill-considered response to a very minor problem, that did far more harm than good, and will leave a permanent scar on the brand.

Why would they always be armed? What is that "as I understand it" understanding based on?

Based on discussions of how they operate back from 10+ years ago when I was fascinated by private security companies/mercenaries (this was triggered in part by finding out they still existed). I've tried to look into it and I can't find anything saying definitively either way. Fascinatingly I haven't been able to find a single image of even one Pinkerton agent in the field in the 21st century. I was able to find a story showing they were also spying on non-union protestors and certainly in operating in armed roles whilst doing so ("protection details" to quote the Pinkerton rep). Modern Day Pinkertons – Anderson Valley Advertiser

In a more recent story a Pinkerton contracted armed security guard killed a political protestor - Former security guard pleads not guilty to murder in Denver protest shooting

The Pinkertons were eager to point out he was subcontracted, but it speaks to the quality of people they work with and contract work they're hired to do out to.

 

[trappedslider]

Pinkerton Detectives Still Exist, and They’re Tired of Being the Bad Guys

The security agents, who gained fame as Old West law enforcers, are still around, now as specialists in corporate security and risk management. They aren’t happy about being antagonists in ‘Red Dead Redemption II.’

www.wsj.com

“You can’t rewrite history to profit,” Mr. Zahran said. (Pinkerton’s president in 2019)

If people aren’t aware the company exists today, he added, it is a testament to how it operates. “We’re a behind-the-scenes organization. We don’t seek the limelight,” he said.

Looking at employee reviews It seems like it might be a decent place to work https://www.indeed.com/cmp/Pinkerton/reviews?fcountry=ALL&fjobtitle=Armed+Security+Officer

oh they also have dental

 

[darjr]

Apparently WotC called his cell with an unlisted number and he didn’t answer, it being unlisted, they didn’t leave voicemail.

 

[Umbran]

Which is exactly why you’d hire someone based on reputation. They have one.

I don't argue that hiring the Pinkertons was a great move, PR-wise.

But, to be frank, as a practical matter anyone experienced in the line of work is almost assured to have sketchy stuff in their background. Squeaky clean private investigators aren't a thing. Pinkertons have a reputation. Everyone else has done bad stuff of which we are ignorant.

And, oldschoolmtg suffered no particular harm in all this, did he?

So, the basic problem is that WotC failed to hire someone whose sketchy deeds were sufficiently hidden from us?

 

[eyeheartawk]

Also, what harm would Hasbro have suffered had they not gotten these cards back?

What information was he sharing that wouldn't have been able to be shared on release day (or whenever the embargo date lifts)?

Near as I can tell the only real defining thing is that this way customers know what they are buying with their money before the set is released (and presumably non-refundable preorders have shipped).

And this is...bad?

 

[Cadence]

Also, what harm would Hasbro have suffered had they not gotten these cards back?

This feels like not tons compared to it being out online... if they could trust they wouldn't go back online or be sold early or whatnot.

What information was he sharing that wouldn't have been able to be shared on release day (or whenever the embargo date lifts)?

It's their copyright on the art, anyway?

Near as I can tell the only real defining thing is that this way customers know what they are buying with their money before the set is released ( and presumably non-refundable preorders have shipped).

Wizards wasn't going to have rolled out spoilers for it using a variety of streamers like they do for most sets, with schedule announced on their page?

 

[Ruin Explorer]

But, to be frank, as a practical matter anyone experienced in the line of work is almost assured to have sketchy stuff in their background. Squeaky clean private investigators aren't a thing. Pinkertons have a reputation. Everyone else has done bad stuff of which we are ignorant.

And, oldschoolmtg suffered no particular harm in all this, did he?

So, the basic problem is that WotC failed to hire someone whose sketchy deeds were sufficiently hidden from us?

No.

The problem is that they hired an agency with a spectacular history of mayhem, violence, even possibly contract killing, which still retains that name, and that agency sent armed men (plural) to his doorstep who identified themselves as being from there.

It's not about "sufficiently hidden". It's about intimidation. The reason they still have that name is to intimidate. The reason they sent armed men to someone's doorstep is to intimidate. This wasn't about an honest discussion. This wasn't discreet. This was a crude and rather unpleasant bullying tactic.

A normal PI would not have had the same impact - nor done the same PR damage.

 

[trappedslider]

@Ruin Explorer you need to find this reviewer and tell him

Great Company​

Agent (Current Employee) - San Diego, CA - April 15, 2021
This is a great company with a great legacy. It can be difficult to get hired at times. You typical need to know someone. I would say 90% of all agents are former local, state and federal Law enforcement.