WotC WotC needs an Elon Musk

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

You can technically get to Athas via planar travel, but leaving is very difficult, as described in the Planescape books.

We're a long way from the days when every fantasy fan was huge into John Carter, but having an Earthling wind up on a fantasy world by accident is ideal for Athas. (You'd probably need a third party background to build them, of course.)

 

[Remathilis]

Yeah, I get it. I'm trying to thread the needle on keeping things both connected and distinct and not impacted too much by that connectivity.

I mean, that's the point.

The X-Men, The Avengers, The Defenders, the Midnight Sons and the Guardians of the Galaxy all exist in the same universe, but they don't exactly rely on each other to tell stories except for the annual crossover. The X-Men don't usually fight Galactus or the Guardians don't worry about the Hand, so barring the times Wolverine teams up with (or fights) Iron Man, the wider universe doesn't matter.

That doesn't mean they would be better off all existing in separate unconnected universes. Or all of them exist on separate planets with only the Guardians ever interacting with other groups. You can just read X-Men booksand worry about mutant problems, but don't get angry when Spider-Man makes a cameo there either.

Which is why I'm against the artificial walling off of settings. It's like saying the Fantastic Four can never interact with the MU, or that Ghost Rider is from a separate universe than Captain America. I get why you might want Eberron and Athas to be remote, but that shouldn't mean they are never accessible.

 

[FitzTheRuke]

Hardcore Gamer: Gamers that like the same things that I like.

Casual Gamer: Gamers that like things that are stupid and wrong.

That's very funny.

OtoH, To take the subject more seriously, I think it's more:

Hardcore Gamer: Has played for decades and/or very intensely (IE spends a lot of waking time prepping for and/or thinking about the game. May or may not post on boards about it, etc. Has probably spend a lot of money on the game. Certainly has spent a lot of time on it.

Casual Gamer: Even if they've played for decades, doesn't spend a lot of time outside the game thinking about it. May or may not know much about any aspect of the game that they don't directly play with, may or may not have spent a lot of time or money on it; probably does NOT post on message boards about it, and if so, not often.

The difference can be subtle, and some people can be hardcore at times in their lives and casual at others.

To use my personal IRL group, I'd say that I'm the only Hardcore member, but my current group ha played together for 14 years, and a couple of them have bought every 4e and 5e books. One of them (the most casual, in that he only makes less than half the games and isn't super familiar with the rules) spends the big bucks on the expensive "miniatures" (like the mounted dragon heads and the big Terrasque) to fill his "man-cave", but isn't all that versed in the game itself, while another one spends almost no money at all but has an encyclopedic knowledge of Realms lore. (And yet I would still count him as a casual gamer - he wouldn't be caught dead on here, for example).

I know their spending habits because, of course, as a retailer, we play after hours at my comic and game store, and they buy all their stuff from me!

 

[MonsterEnvy]

I think he means lorebooks.

Someone mentioned Fizban's, but 5e's strat has been producing all-in-ones instead of things like Campaign Settings, player options books, etc.

Last I check we have gotten Lore based books too.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Is this something fans of those settings would actually want?

(Spoiler: I dont.)

Unfortunately, the new books aren't for fans of the settings, beyond a nostalgia grab. They are leveraging their IP for the throngs of new players they are putting nearly all their attention on, and using old IP because its easier than creating new IP.

At least, that's my take.

 

[Micah Sweet]

A core element of Ravenloft is that the mists reach into other worlds to pull in great evils and hapless adventurers, who can seek to escape. You can ignore that part, but it's pretty deep in there.

But that isn't  all it is, despite 5e "take" on the setting.

 

[Micah Sweet]

An element, yes. I would not say core. I have the 2e boxed set and very little is dedicated to the mists going to other worlds. It's really just a minor mention. The core elements of the mist are separating the islands from the main group of domains and it being really hard to travel the mists without Vistani.

The domains are all said to come from elsewhere, but you don't have to do that. You can have a 100% Ravenloft game without ever getting into travel to or from other worlds. You don't even have to go out of your way not to mention it. Just run a party born in Ravenloft through Ravenloft domains. Other worlds simply don't come up if you do that.

The last 2e Ravenloft setting sourcebook (Domains of Dread) and all the 3e stuff operated on the assumption of PCs native to Ravenloft, with visitors being an option. It was only after WotC took the license back that it reverted to the old "weekend in hell" for the sporadic releases its received since then.

 

[Incenjucar]

But that isn't  all it is, despite 5e "take" on the setting.

The travel settings are all multidimensional. Even Spelljammer works fine without the existing D&D worlds as long as there are some kinds of ports to supply at and trade between, like asteroid islands or something.

 

[Remathilis]

Unfortunately, the new books aren't for fans of the settings, beyond a nostalgia grab. They are leveraging their IP for the throngs of new players they are putting nearly all their attention on, and using old IP because its easier than creating new IP.

At least, that's my take.

But if WotC had done a completely different horror setting (say, Innistrad or Something New) then the fans would hoot and holler about how Ravenloft was ignored in favor of some new hotness. This would have been made doubly worse if any elements from the older setting got reused in the new one (either directly or indirectly). WotC would be ignoring a memorable IP (or two, if they opted for new over Innistrad) and start with a brand-new, never used IP because they were afraid changing the Vistani of Ravenloft would hurt some Superfan's fee-fees.

 

[Remathilis]

The last 2e Ravenloft setting sourcebook (Domains of Dread) and all the 3e stuff operated on the assumption of PCs native to Ravenloft, with visitors being an option. It was only after WotC took the license back that it reverted to the old "weekend in hell" for the sporadic releases its received since then.

Keep in mind that as of Domains of Dread, several Darklords were pulled from every TSR setting in print. Vecna, Kas and Azalin were all from Greyhawk. Tristan, Easan and Hazlik were from Forgotten Realms, Tsien Chiang from Kara-Tur, Vlad Drakov from Taladas, Thakok-An from Dark Sun, Meredoth from Mystara, Boyar Gregor Zolnik from Birthright, and Lord Soth from Dragonlance. (And it's been a minute, I might have missed one). So while the PCs might have become more local, many of the lords themselves were from all over the Multiverse.