Dragonlance WotC Officially Confirms Takhisis and Tiamat Are The Same

It's been an issue in dispute for decades, over various editions of D&D, but WotC has officially confirmed that - at least in 5E - Dragonlance's Takhisis is, indeed, currently Tiamat. In previous editions, Tiamat has varied from being a big dragon to a minor goddess, while Takhisis has been a greater god on Krynn. At times they've been the same entity, and at others different entities. Today, WotC is putting its foot down and saying that Takhisis and Tiamat are, indeed, the same being.



Of course, this is not an opinion universally held. Dragonlance co-creator Margaret Weis emphatically stated that "TAKHISIS IS NOT TIAMAT, DAMN IT!"

Fizban's Treasuryof Dragons confirms that the beings echo across various settings.

D&D 5E - Is Paladine Bahamut? Is Takhisis Tiamat? Fizban's Treasury Might Reveal The Answer!

According to WotC's James Wyatt, Fizban's Treasury of Dragons introduces a new cosmology for dragon gods, where the same beings, including Fizban, echo across various D&D campaign settings with alternate versions of themselves (presumably like Paladine/Bahamut, or Takhisis/Tiamat). Also... the...

www.enworld.org

 

[cbwjm]

This is the original Tiamat: Tiamat - Wikipedia

EDIT: According to Wikipedia: "The depiction of Tiamat as a multi-headed dragon was popularized in the 1970s as a fixture of the Dungeons & Dragons roleplaying game inspired by earlier sources associating Tiamat with later mythological characters such as Lotan (Leviathan)."

She had a different depiction in FR originally, a 3 headed dragon goddess arriving from our earth with the rest of the Babylonian and Egyptian gods. I think that was largely glossed over though since though.

 

[pukunui]

I've always thought that Tiamat as a multi-headed dragon was also meant to invoke the multi-headed dragon from the Book of Revelation. You know, the one with seven heads, seven crowns, and ten horns.

 

[Incenjucar]

Honestly the idea that Tiamat isn't at least five beings is kind of odd.

 

[Lidgar]

That would be a weird hill to die on.

True. More likely to die in…

 

[kerleth]

This is the original Tiamat: Tiamat - Wikipedia

EDIT: According to Wikipedia: "The depiction of Tiamat as a multi-headed dragon was popularized in the 1970s as a fixture of the Dungeons & Dragons roleplaying game inspired by earlier sources associating Tiamat with later mythological characters such as Lotan (Leviathan)."

Guess the satanic panic people were right, playing DnD really was consorting with pagan gods. Being a thing is precisely the same as being inspired by a thing after all. I for one welcome our new corporate draconic overlords. OceaniaTakhisis has always been at war with EastasiaTiamat. (Really though, I'm glad someone else mentioned the original Takhisis/Tiamat. The whole conversation reminds me of an IRL self avowed nerd arguing about a Thor character who just couldn't understand the thing they were criticizing wasn't a bad knock off of the "original" comic book Thor. Instead it was based off of the thing comic book Thor was a "knock off" of. Ugh.)

To be quasi-serious though, WOTC went full corporate (never go full corporate) a while back. There may be a very well thought out reason for officially decreeing Takhisis status. But there doesn't need to be. Leaving control/power in the hands of other people just doesn't fit well in the corporate mindset. It's like me not eating a chip I just dropped on the floor. Sure, I've done it. But more often than not, it'll go the other way. Not for any particular reason, but because the nature of how I work pushes me in the direction. And the nature of a large corporation is to control things/amass power. Even if it makes them sick. On the plus side, maybe we can switch to a Dragon Cinematic Universe for a couple decades.

 

[dave2008]

I'll go with Weis and Hickman over other writers revisions.

View attachment 266885

That is not how it works. Dragonlance wasn't Weis & Hickman's. It was a group of people that created the setting and it started with Jeff Grub's home game and mythos. There was even an article on here about it recently (sorry my search-fu couldn't find it) that described the origin of Paladin and Takhisis and they were indeed the Platinum dragon and the Chromatic dragon as this was before the MM and they did not yet have the names Bahamut and Tiamat yet. However, that was their origin. The name Paladin comes pretty directly from Jeff's home game, but he didn't know where exactly Weis/Hickman came up with name Takhisis. Regardless, she was always intended to be the "Chromatic Dragon," aka Tiamat.

Edit: It wasn't this forum, Jeff Grub interview

 

[dave2008]

Does that wiki entry nail down some possible dates for the new adventure?

Someone in another thread created a potential timeline based on what was know at the time (and this video confirmed their guesses to an extent), and though I don't remember the dates, it was potentially after Goldman discovered the discs. So potentially no cleric retcon is needed.

 

[kerleth]

That is not how it works. Dragonlance wasn't Weis & Hickman's. It was a group of people that created the setting and it started with Jeff Grub's home game and mythos...... The name Paladin comes pretty directly from Jeff's home game....

In the spirit of a previous post about historicity, the joy of random trivia, and understanding the labyrinthine set of inspirations and assumptions that have shaped this wonderful hobby; Paladin

 

[DarkCrisis]

Please do. I keep seeing that tiny little screenshot shared around and would love to know the source/context.

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[Weiley31]

I mean, Fizban's Treasury of Dragons states it is entirely possible for a Dragon, especially one of considerable power, to have multiple "Echoes" across the Multiverse. (Ala the Variants of the MCU).

Tahksis being an Echo of Tiamat doesn't change the fact that they are one and the same. Tiamat having an Echo called Tahksis doesn't change the fact that they "can't" be the same as well.

Plus, I always associated them as the same since Tahksis was Tiamat with the serial number filed off anyway. Or was it the other way around?