Wow- How did I miss this all these years??

[Thurbane]

The ELH is included in the 3.5 SRD.

Note, however, that the specific feat in question is not included in the SRD.

 

[Zurai]

Note, however, that the specific feat in question is not included in the SRD.

Which doesn't mean anything. There are quite a number of things from the core three that aren't included. Shin Okada was attempting to say that the entire ELH was something that shouldn't be allowed in 3.5 games; the mere presence of 95% of the book (completely unchanged, at that) in the official 3.5 SRD pretty much negates such a position. Considering that magic item DCs didn't change in the 3.0 to 3.5 transition, there's no reason for the feat in question to not be usable as-is.

 

[Shin Okada]

Which doesn't mean anything. There are quite a number of things from the core three that aren't included. Shin Okada was attempting to say that the entire ELH was something that shouldn't be allowed in 3.5 games; the mere presence of 95% of the book (completely unchanged, at that) in the official 3.5 SRD pretty much negates such a position. Considering that magic item DCs didn't change in the 3.0 to 3.5 transition, there's no reason for the feat in question to not be usable as-is.

Well, that is depend largely on each play group's interpretation and stance on 3.0e rules and SRD files.

Basically, SRD files are not the official set of D&D rules indeed. They are d20 3.5e on the web and not D&D products.

And as Thurbane wrote, the said feat is not even on 3.5e SRD. So that is not a part of D&D 3.5e by any means.

Regarding magic item DC, it changed. Staff got new rule in DMG. And there is Rulestaff in MIC. It seems that 3.5e is trying to take different approach on making spell-trigger items with potentially higher DC.

Of course, no one stops you to use it if you think that feat is still cause no trouble on 3.5e environment. But IMHO 3.5e magic staff and runestaff are the better, well-balanced solution.

 

[irdeggman]

Well here is a question.

Enhance Item is not listed in the SRD.

It is also not listed in the Epic Level handbook Update which also states:

All non-epic feats that appeared in the Epic Level Handbook now appear either in the Player’s Handbook or the Monster Manual, with the exception of Improved Flyby Attack (see below). Consult those books for the revised versions of those feats.

Which seem to indicate that if it is not included in the handbook or the PHB/MM then it no longer is valid for 3.5 use.

But the feat does appear on the consolidated list of feats at the WotC site.

Based on order of precedence I would say that the feat is no longer valid in 3.5 (unless it appears in a subsequent product - but no luck so far as I know). Because written text takes precedence over tables (and the consolidated lists are tables).

It is also not addressed in the FAQ.

 

[Mistwell]

Well, that is depend largely on each play group's interpretation and stance on 3.0e rules and SRD files.

Basically, SRD files are not the official set of D&D rules indeed. They are d20 3.5e on the web and not D&D products.

If "official" means something, however, then the feat is fine. "Officially" any 3.0 feat that was not replaced by a new 3.5 rule still exists in 3.5, and remains with a simple "Not yet revised" tag on it. Wizards went out of it's way to tell people that 3.0 books and rules were not being entirely replaced, just specific things in them. Of course, at this point many people simply don't buy that claim anymore, but it's still the official rule.

And as Thurbane wrote, the said feat is not even on 3.5e SRD. So that is not a part of D&D 3.5e by any means.

On the contrary, WOTC disagrees with you and has said many times that 3.0 feats that were not revised or replaced are still valid feats. It's just that most people seem to have houseruled away that claim, as more and more books came out for 3.5.

 

[Mistwell]

Well here is a question.

Enhance Item is not listed in the SRD.

It is also not listed in the Epic Level handbook Update which also states:



Which seem to indicate that if it is not included in the handbook or the PHB/MM then it no longer is valid for 3.5 use.

But the feat does appear on the consolidated list of feats at the WotC site.

Based on order of precedence I would say that the feat is no longer valid in 3.5 (unless it appears in a subsequent product - but no luck so far as I know). Because written text takes precedence over tables (and the consolidated lists are tables).

It is also not addressed in the FAQ.

Actually it just seems that they forgot about the feat, not that it was specifically not included. When they say all feats except one...they are clearly mistaken.

 

[Zurai]

Basically, SRD files are not the official set of D&D rules indeed. They are d20 3.5e on the web and not D&D products.

And as Thurbane wrote, the said feat is not even on 3.5e SRD. So that is not a part of D&D 3.5e by any means.

Which is it? On one hand you say that the SRD is not official D&D, and on the other you say that if it isn't in the SRD it isn't official D&D. Seriously, man, figure out what you're saying, because these four consecutive sentences are directly contradictory.

 

[Drowbane]

Yes. And that means it is not 3.5e rule. Don't mix them. Don't try it at your home.

Sorry, 3.5 did not make everything 3.0 obsolete.

edit: thats what 4e is for

 

[Storme]

Which is it? On one hand you say that the SRD is not official D&D, and on the other you say that if it isn't in the SRD it isn't official D&D. Seriously, man, figure out what you're saying, because these four consecutive sentences are directly contradictory.

It doesn't really matter Zurai. If your DM wants to use Mongoose Press as Core, or d6's in place of d20's...thats up to him. WoTC (or us) has no say in the matter.

Given what we've seen here, its clear that WoTC is fine with it...now its up to all our local DMs.


Storme

 

[irdeggman]

Actually it just seems that they forgot about the feat, not that it was specifically not included. When they say all feats except one...they are clearly mistaken.

Hmm how clear do you mean?

I also hate to say what their intent was when more than one source is in agreement with it.

Namely the SRD and the EL Handbook update.

Looking at where the feat is located in the book - it would appear as if it was "intended" to be an optional feat that could be used to help juice up magic items in the game. Which as somehave pointed out has been somewhat addressed in the changes in magic items made in 3.5 itself.

More evidence that this was an "optional" feat is in the way (and location) it was presented.
Much like the way that Collegiate Wizard and Precocious Apprentice are presented in Complete Arcane.