D&D 5E Xanathar’s Guide to Everything is the fastest-selling Dungeons & Dragons book of all time

[Wulffolk]

You never answered my question so I'm just going to go ahead and assume no amount of evidence will change your mind.

Actually, I very precisely answered your question. I said it would take some evidence proving a correlation between the slow release schedule and 5e's success. It takes more than simply stating "5e has good sales so the slow release schedule must be why". Your assumption that no amount of evidence would convince me is a cop-out for not being to answer my response.

Again, I am not even arguing whether or not 5e is a success, or more successful than previous editions, just that the slow release schedule has less to do with it than other factors. And if the slow release schedule is not the deciding factor, then WotC would do even better if they released a moderate amount of material instead of a minimal amount.

 

[Wulffolk]

Someone in the thread commented that the more total books there are in 5e the more shelf space D&D will take up in the FLGS.

That is true, and really bad for D&D sales. New players. That is what drives sales. New players don't want to see 20 books on the shelves.

There are only certain types of people that go to the FLGS.
RPG players, war gamers and card gamers

Not one of those types of players would be intimidated by a few more books on the shelf. It might actually get more attention from them.

Casual non-gamers do not go to the FLGS in the first place, and if the did it would not be a few more books on the shelf that made D&D seem nerdy compared to the crowd of socially awkward card gamers that they would witness there.

Also, it is a mix of attracting new players and retaining old players that will keep the hobby growing. What good is a crowd of new casual players that will disappear when they grow bored if all of your core group of old-timers fade away because you aren't giving them what they want?

 

[ad_hoc]

Actually, I very precisely answered your question.

This was your response.

I have seen a lot of people claim that because D&D is doing well right now it must be due to the slow release schedule. What evidence has been presented that supports that correlation?

I have seen people claim that producing more books would reduce sales, because 3.5e, instead of acknowledging what the root cause of the problems with 3.5e were. What evidence has been presented to support that claim?

I haven't asked you to convince me to change my mind. I have only shared my opinion. You are welcome to disagree. I am open to changing my opinion if I read something more convincing than "5e D&D is doing better than previous editions, so they could not possibly do better than they are right now." If the leadership of the D&D team was infallible then 90% of the discussions on this forum would be pointless.

It doesn't really matter if I have a different opinion than most, or if either of us change our minds, WotC is doing it their way, and all we can do is make the best of what they release. I am just disappointed that they keep producing things that I have no interest in, like adventure paths, instead of material that I believe that most players find more interesting.

Nothing precise about that.

 

[ad_hoc]

There are only certain types of people that go to the FLGS.
RPG players, war gamers and card gamers

Not one of those types of players would be intimidated by a few more books on the shelf. It might actually get more attention from them.

Casual non-gamers do not go to the FLGS in the first place, and if the did it would not be a few more books on the shelf that made D&D seem nerdy compared to the crowd of socially awkward card gamers that they would witness there.

Where is your data on that?

You keep making outlandish claims as though you have some sort of special insider information.

I know for a fact that non-gamers do go to FLGS to buy boardgames and, not RPGs per se, but 5e specifically.

By non-gamers I mean the sort of people who will play boardgames at a boardgame cafe but not actually be part of a boardgame meetup, have a sizable collection, go to conventions, be on internet forums, etc.

Not only do I know people anecdotally who defy your statements, but it is the easiest explanation for the massive growth and success of D&D and the RPG market as a result.

Also, not all FLGS have toxic atmospheres like you have alluded to.

Also, it is a mix of attracting new players and retaining old players that will keep the hobby growing. What good is a crowd of new casual players that will disappear when they grow bored if all of your core group of old-timers fade away because you aren't giving them what they want?

I'm going to replace 'old-timers' with 'people who frequent message boards and live and breathe D&D'.

Most of the old-timer RPG players I know have RPG fatigue and too much going on in their lives to keep up book releases, not that they really care about that sort of thing anyway. They just need to have an adventure to play so they don't have to make up their own.

 

[Wulffolk]

I am open to changing my opinion if I read something more convincing than "5e D&D is doing better than previous editions, so they could not possibly do better than they are right now."

Nothing precise about that.

Nope, nothing precise there. How can I argue with that kind of logic?

 

[ad_hoc]

Nope, nothing precise there. How can I argue with that kind of logic?

I asked you what, if any, evidence would change your mind and you responded with a wall of text containing a vague statement about reading 'something more convincing', which is really back to no evidence at all because you will decide what is convincing to you.

What you are doing here is moving the goalposts (actually I take that back, there are no goalposts at all). So there is no headway to be made.

Also, for the record, you have made the claim that WotC will make more money by printing more books, the burden of proof really is on you. I thought I'd give you a bone by letting you tell us what would be convincing to you. You still haven't answered.

 

[Wulffolk]

You keep making outlandish claims ...

I know for a fact that non-gamers do go to FLGS to buy boardgames and, not RPGs per se, but 5e specifically.

Also, not all FLGS have toxic atmospheres like you have alluded to.

Have you been in a FLGS? is it really that outlandish?

You keep asking me for data to back my statements, but are perfectly fine relying on anecdotal experience for your own statements. Ironic, isn't it?

You really do need to stop putting words in other people's mouths to try to obscure your own inability to make a valid point. At no point did I call FLGS's a toxic environment.

 

[Wulffolk]

[MENTION=6749462]ad-hoc[/MENTION] Really? Two short paragraphs were a wall of text? I am sorry for putting up such a challenge for you.

 

[Wulffolk]

Double post

 

[ad_hoc]

Have you been in a FLGS? is it really that outlandish?

You keep asking me for data to back my statements, but are perfectly fine relying on anecdotal experience for your own statements. Ironic, isn't it?

You really do need to stop putting words in other people's mouths to try to obscure your own inability to make a valid point. At no point did I call FLGS's a toxic environment.

Yes, I have. There are 2 great FLGS in my city that I frequent and have great atmospheres that are welcoming to people.

When you make a statement such as 'casual gamers do not go to FLGS' then anecdotal evidence is all that is needed because it only takes 1 example to show it is wrong.

Also, a claim presented without evidence can be dismissed without evidence.

[MENTION=6749462]ad-hoc[/MENTION] Really? Two short paragraphs were a wall of text? I am sorry for putting up such a challenge for you.

There is no challenge.

You said your reply was precise. 4 paragraphs with one vague statement which doesn't actually address the question asked is not precise.

If you aren't going to meet your burden of proof at least state what would be convincing to you.