[XPH] Psion versus Wizard/Sorcerer

[Falling Icicle]

I don't mean to drag the discussion off topic, but I'm havig a hard time following since I don't have the XPH. Would somebody mind explaining to me how psionics can spend extra PP to make a power higher level? This sounds very different from how their manifestation worked before.

Also, I heard that the Wilder has only 11 powers known at 20th level. What do they get that is so almighty to justify such a crippling small power selection?

 

[James McMurray]

If you're looking to deal damage, a Kineticist is probably the way to go. But if you don't mind delaying your acquisition of some of the powers, and subclass will work because you can grab the powers you want via Extended Knowledge.

 

[Dinkeldog]

3rd level has the fun Energy Cone,
and 4th has the fun Energy Ball.

Both Psion powers, albiet Kineticist it seems.

Do not taunt fun Energy Ball.

 

[reiella]

As another note, there's Energy Burst, a 3rd level psion power, that pretty much follows suit with the other energy series.

Of course, it's a Single-Burst type power, but fits the same general damage scale.

 

[Particle_Man]

I don't mean to drag the discussion off topic, but I'm havig a hard time following since I don't have the XPH. Would somebody mind explaining to me how psionics can spend extra PP to make a power higher level? This sounds very different from how their manifestation worked before.

Also, I heard that the Wilder has only 11 powers known at 20th level. What do they get that is so almighty to justify such a crippling small power selection?

Powers cost the same number of points as the Psion level at the earliest point the psion could get a power of that level (so 1, 3, 5, etc.). Some powers can be augmented by spending more points, but never can more points be spent than the psionic character has levels in the relevant psionic class. What augmentation will do varies with the power, but often includes more damage, a higher save DC, etc.

The wilder can basically "augment for free" and thus use a power as if she has put points into it to augment it one or more levels. Kaaaaaa-BOOOM! But, there is a chance that the wilder could mess herself up by doing this.

 

[kigmatzomat]

I don't mean to drag the discussion off topic, but I'm havig a hard time following since I don't have the XPH. Would somebody mind explaining to me how psionics can spend extra PP to make a power higher level? This sounds very different from how their manifestation worked before.

It's basically a power boost. Spend more energy, get more oomph. Damaging spells generally get more dice while others get more duration. I haven't looked at XPH in detail, but I suppose a concentration power might get more range.

Also, I heard that the Wilder has only 11 powers known at 20th level. What do they get that is so almighty to justify such a crippling small power selection?

Factor in the above. In 3e you'd have Lesser Power, Power, and True Power, each costing more PP and being higher levels. In XPH there's just Power and you need to spend additional PP to boost the levels. A 5th level psion can't generate 10d6 explosions from a base-3d6 power but he could do 5d6. Which means you need to know fewer powers to have the same damage potential.

The flip side of this is that a 400th level Psion manifesting a base 3d6 power only gets 3d6 damage unless he spends extra PPs. Contrast this with mages who's fireball spell keeps getting bigger (until it hits the die cap) for the same spell level.

It's balanced, but in an odd way. Rather I should say it *seems* balanced since until I get some play testing in it could be way off. But since Psions generally sucked unless you used the broken powers (i.e. cocoon) I think this might be better.

 

[Thanee]

Yep, I think the spells and powers are pretty much equal (as much as you can say that about such different approaches).

Powers have the advantage of being upgradeable infinitely, but do not scale automatically, while spells automatically scale, but are capped and need to be replaced by higher versions or similar higher level spells, or need metamagic to achieve a compareable result. This gives psions a little edge, as they also get the higher level powers in addition, but then again, their selection is quite a bit smaller, where they have to choose from.

The non-scaling and augmentability also solves a problem with higher level psions, which could manifest huge amounts of low level powers. While this is still possible, those won't be very useful in most cases. This way psions actually have a similar amount of powers per day compared to the spellcasters, not many more. Still, they have a lot more flexibility and most importantly, the ability to manifest a large amount of high level powers at the expense of the lower level ones. This gets continually stronger the higher levels the psion reaches (not sure how this will affect epic levels, tho).

Bye
Thanee

 

[reiella]

Something else just noticed

Psicrystals are a bit different than Familiars [and less advantagesome in some ways]

Finding out Psicrystals gain hp was a nice fun exercise [it's not mentioned in the ability writeup, only in the monster stat block].

If a psicrystal is destroyed. The Psion cannot replace the Psicrystal.

Psicrystal Affinity cannot be taken multiple times, and the only way to gain the Psicrystal is with the feat. But, in event of death, the Psion doesn't lose experience or the like, just a Void Feat.

I think this may just be a technical oversight though honestly.

 

[Thanee]

It's getting more and more ridiculous the more you look through the book.

Metamorphic Transfer! What are they thinking by putting in such a feat? Are they even thinking? I really wonder...

Psionic Meditation, combined with Quicken Power and Schism allows 3 powers per round!

Bye
Thanee

 

[Shadowdweller]

Anyways, yes, of course there are some powers that are weaker than compareable spells (Dominate Person being a very good (and weird - why are psions worse with one of their signature powers?) example), but there are plenty which are better as well, so all in all, that evens out (that is powers are roughly equal in power compared to arcane spells of similar level).

You mean ASIDE from the fact that Psionic Domination A) affects monsters (with augmentation) and B) can affect MULTIPLE TARGETS AT ONCE (with augmentation)? Don't these latter make it sort of replicate the effect of a 9th level spell?

Metamorphic Transfer! What are they thinking by putting in such a feat? Are they even thinking? I really wonder...

Oy! I had such high hopes for this book. Of course, I can't say that I've had a chance to playtest anything. So maybe it's not really as broken as it seems...pretty please?