Status of D&D Game Table?

[Asmor]

I think they said certain tiles will be in 3d as well. This wouldn't invalidate your thoughts though, as you could still import other stuff... Just to get the fancy, you'd need to use the WoTC tiles.

Hence, "some select accessories."

I think some examples they mentioned were things like statues and fiery urns. Definitely not "backbone" stuff, just window dressing.

 

[Scribble]

Hence, "some select accessories."

I think some examples they mentioned were things like statues and fiery urns. Definitely not "backbone" stuff, just window dressing.

Yeah I figured that's what you meant, but only after I posted. I thought about changing my post, but then figured. eh screw it.

I'm lazy like that.

 

[heruca]

And none of the third party applications are acceptable?

Which ones are you referring to? I am not very familiar with anything outside of what WotC does.

Here's a comprehensive list of all the virtual tabletop programs for RPGs.

And here's a VT Feature Comparison Chart that compares a handful of the more popular VTs. Note, however, that some of the information on that chart is a bit out of date.

 

[guivre]

Eventually you will get it (I would bet by the end of the year).

I'll take that bet.

It is highly unlikely that the VTT will ever materialize. It's obvious to an experienced eye that they really do not know what they're doing and they don't have the resources to undertake a program that complex. Their history is appalling. So far they've release (late) a glorified wiki, and a barely passable Character Generator (which isn't even actually released yet).

If they even managed to release the game table it would fall under it's own weight. WotC simply doesn't currently have the skills or staff to maintain it.

Unless there is significant restructuring on the project it will never materialize. In the long run that is probably for the best, the train wreck that would result from releasing what they're currently capable of would do far more damage than never releasing it at all.

At this point they would be MUCH better served licensing out the ability to create a game table to a 3rd party and making that the "official" VTT for 4e.

 

[Asmor]

So far they've release (late) a glorified wiki, and a barely passable Character Generator (which isn't even actually released yet).

I'm assuming that the "glorified wiki" you're referring to is the compendium, which is not remotely similar to a wiki in any sense of the word. The compendium is, in my mind, a success, though it could certainly be improved upon, and in its initial incarnation was a complete let down.

The character generated, on the other hand, is an unmitigated success and this is literally the first negative thing I've seen about it. Have you even used it? What exactly are your complaints?

FWIW, I generally agree with you on most of your points (though I wouldn't trust WotC to farm the VTT out, either; 3rd party developers didn't help the master tools or Magic Online very much either...), but that sentence seemed out of place and unnecessarily vitriolic.

 

[Majoru Oakheart]

2D-tiles + ability to import my own = teh winz0rs. I would hope that WotC would go that route, and not try to drive people toward purchasing tiles by making it impossible to import from other sources.

The last word I heard about this before they stopped talking about the Game Table was that they were likely going to include all of the Dungeon Tiles ever made as 2d tiles. They were going to make 3d versions of many of the tiles, but they were going to charge extra money for the 3d versions. They would also include 2d tokens for monsters, but they were going to sell 3d versions of select monsters.

They implied they'd be really cheap prices. But they seemed to expect that most DMs would find it much cooler to be able to place real, 3d monsters on the table and would pay the couple extra dollars.

 

[guivre]

I'm assuming that the "glorified wiki" you're referring to is the compendium, which is not remotely similar to a wiki in any sense of the word. The compendium is, in my mind, a success, though it could certainly be improved upon, and in its initial incarnation was a complete let down.

You're free to disagree, but that's all it is. It's a web based information repository with limited search capabilities. Comparing it to a wiki is more than fair. There is nothing special about it and there's really no excuse that it couldn't have been completed by release.

The character generated, on the other hand, is an unmitigated success and this is literally the first negative thing I've seen about it. Have you even used it? What exactly are your complaints?

Yes I've used it and there were a host of usability and stability issues when I did.

An unmitigated success is it? That's some fantastic praise for an unreleased piece of software. It already fails at the number one requirement for successful software: it hasn't been released.

What criteria is this unmitigated success based on? It's beta status over 7 months after intended release? The swarms of yet unresolved bugs?

Far from there being nothing negative, there are swarms of bugs posted on WotCs forums. Enough that it doesn't fulfill it's function: creating legal characters for 4e. New books come out monthly, the PHB II comes out in what.. March? Even IF they managed to iron out enough bugs to make a passable release, they're going to do so just in time for it to be out-dated.

FWIW, I generally agree with you on most of your points (though I wouldn't trust WotC to farm the VTT out, either; 3rd party developers didn't help the master tools or Magic Online very much either...), but that sentence seemed out of place and unnecessarily vitriolic.

I didn't say they would or even that I trusted them to. I said they should. Employing one of the companies that already produces a VTT to provide the licensed VTT for 4e would be the best move they could possibly make right now, assuming they chose that third party wisely.

It's not vitriolic, it is an honest, qualified opinion from someone with 25 years experience. The pattern is very clear, this is a mess and the odds are it's only going to get messier. Some companies pull it out, but the overwhelming majority do not, not without a great deal of help.

There is nothing about this operation that doesn't scream train wreck. My professional opinion, backed by seeing similar cases would be that they eventually get the Character Builder out. It's still going to have bugs, but they'll push it out the door is good enough. I'd lay even money that it doesn't come out till March. The limited staff they already have will end up in maintenance mode, trying to get the bugs fixed. It's going to take full time employees to keep it up to date. Even with the benefit of seeing some of the material before hand they're going to fall behind and constantly be in maintenance mode trying to incorporate all of the material released. It's not just the books, it's the magazine content as well, and the LFR material. Between the "content" bugs, and the software bugs that are bound to occur it's going to cost a fortune in developer hours just to try and keep the project afloat.

In the meantime they'll pick the Character Visualizer to work on next, I seriously doubt they'll have the resources to work on more than one tool at a time. They don't have them now and they certainly won't after the CB is released and they are constantly trying to keep up.

The visualizer will seem like a good pick, because it's relatively simple, it's really nothing a hobbyist with a good 3D package couldn't do at home. Though TBH if I were in there as a consultant I'd recommend they can that product completely. They'll still struggle to get it out, but before they do, Hasbro is going to pull the plug. It's going to turn into a money sink and they're not going to stand for it up top very long.

Like I said, I could be wrong, but if I wasn't right far more often than not I wouldn't be pulling down the salary I am. It's entirely possible that DDI can be turned around, but the smart money will certainly not be on that happening.

I have no hate for WotC only disappointment. Nor am I a 4e hater. I own everything published since it's release, except the "premium dice".

 

[Echohawk]

What criteria is this unmitigated success based on?

Possibly on a number of fairly favourable reviews.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

You're free to disagree, but that's all it is. It's a web based information repository with limited search capabilities. Comparing it to a wiki is more than fair.

A Wikis unique feature is that other users can contribute to them and add material, typically in an easy way. (Easy compared to creating your own website, at least.)

A wiki is a page or collection of Web pages designed to enable anyone who accesses it to contribute or modify content, using a simplified markup language.[1][2] Wikis are often used to create collaborative websites and to power community websites.

Now, Wikipedia might not always qualify as the best source for a definition, but in case of Wikis, I think it is a very good authority.

 

[Charwoman Gene]

The character builder is not an unmitigated success. It is a success thus farm, save for the delay issues.