D&D Insider: Losing your toys

[Irda Ranger]

Shockingly, paying for services rather than products is quite common and accepted in our society. See waitresses, maids, gardeners, repairmen, utilities, etc.

Shockingly another common practice, when dealing with finished products (as opposed to services) is to buy them and expect them to own them indefinitely. See cars, Swiss army knives, D&D books, etc.

A lot of you seem to be assuming that you will be the one canceling the DDI service, not Wizards. Considering the experiences of many people who bought DRM-ed music from various online stores that have gone bust, or Wizards' track record for supporting electronic services, I don't think that's a safe assumption to make. Not at all.

Maybe I'm weird, but as someone who still owns, reads and plays RC D&D and AD&D 2e, I'm sort of assuming I'll want to use the character builder long after Wizards has moved on. Or when my Windows install inevitably fails and I have to install the software on a new computer.

 

[maddman75]

2. With respect to the compendium, there's not much to be done about that. It's a members-only website. Theoretically, you're welcome to query it and save every single bit of info in it to your local system, of course.

I would read the user agreement very carefully before I tried that. Most people tend to be touchy about running spiders on their databases, even if they aren't a pay service. I doubt that's the kind of thing they want the users doing.

I would be very surprised if you would be allowed to query their database at all apart from through their web site.

 

[Asmor]

Shockingly another common practice, when dealing with finished products (as opposed to services) is to buy them and expect them to own them indefinitely. See cars, Swiss army knives, D&D books, etc.

You're right. But a subscription to DDI is not a finished product. Dragon and Dungeon certainly are, and you get to keep those. You also get to keep the character builder. So I fail to see the problem.

A lot of you seem to be assuming that you will be the one canceling the DDI service, not Wizards. Considering the experiences of many people who bought DRM-ed music from various online stores that have gone bust, or Wizards' track record for supporting electronic services, I don't think that's a safe assumption to make. Not at all.

On the contrary, I assume no such thing. I'm fully aware that it's possible for the DDI to literally disappear over night. In fact, I'd even say it's at least slightly likely. It wouldn't surprise me if Hasbro's watching the DDI like a hawk and prepared to turn it off the moment they decide it's not meeting expectations.

That said, I use the monthly option. I pay $8 for a month's access to the compendium, two magazines, and an update to my character builder. I'm quite happy with that.

Maybe I'm weird, but as someone who still owns, reads and plays RC D&D and AD&D 2e, I'm sort of assuming I'll want to use the character builder long after Wizards has moved on. Or when my Windows install inevitably fails and I have to install the software on a new computer.

That's a totally valid concern. Hopefully, whenever they do discontinue they'll give out a permanently-unlocked, install anywhere version of the character builder. Of course, there's no guarantee they'll do anything like that.

Ultimately, though, it comes down to this: they are offering a service, they're being up front about the terms, and it's up to you to decide if you're happy with them or not. If you are, subscribe, if you aren't, don't.

 

[Mort]

Shockingly another common practice, when dealing with finished products (as opposed to services) is to buy them and expect them to own them indefinitely. See cars, Swiss army knives, D&D books, etc.

A lot of you seem to be assuming that you will be the one canceling the DDI service, not Wizards. Considering the experiences of many people who bought DRM-ed music from various online stores that have gone bust, or Wizards' track record for supporting electronic services, I don't think that's a safe assumption to make. Not at all.

Maybe I'm weird, but as someone who still owns, reads and plays RC D&D and AD&D 2e, I'm sort of assuming I'll want to use the character builder long after Wizards has moved on. Or when my Windows install inevitably fails and I have to install the software on a new computer.

All of the Dragon and Dungeon stuff is yours for as long as you save it or print it. That alone is worth $5.00 a month.

And I do believe you are misreading the character builder faq - you cannot update if you cancel but you keep what you have. Your quote of the faq was in upgrading to the full version - not once you have it. what the character builder already contains is worth more than $5 already.

 

[Miar]

To me if I was subscribing and was really into 4E this would be a problem.

1. If I was just broke or I like the first couple of years of product but then reached the "enough" point as many did with 3.5 I might stop subscribing. If I ever got a new computer or had to reinstall for any reason I would need to buy the software again.

2. If 4E is still my game of choice whenever 5E came out and I needed to reinstall or whatever would that be possible? Would 5E subscribers to whatever service they have then get all the old 4E stuff? If not how would I get the character builder back with all its updates.

All and all I really can't agree with this model

 

[Mark]

Think about it: You don't own that software. You're committed to paying that recurring cost for as long as you want to use the software, and that's assuming that WotC wants to sell it to you.

So you are renting the software?

 

[Aegeri]

But doesn't it bother anyone else that if you stop subscribing to DDI that your Character Builder and Compendium stop working? It's not that they stop receiving updates, I mean they no longer function. The CB and Compendium revert to the "Demo" versions and any characters you made above 3rd level can no longer be edited (I just got off the phone with Wizards and have confirmed this).

You are talking absolute bollocks. I had my DDI account accidentally "canceled" the other day, which was annoying in itself due to a computer error (which was in fact fixed within 24 hours of me informing them). I happily built 3-4 8th level characters during the day without any problem, despite the fact I no longer counted as being subscribed to DDI at all.

Please stop spreading misinformation.

 

[Miar]

You are talking absolute bollocks. I had my DDI account accidentally "canceled" the other day, which was annoying in itself due to a computer error (which was in fact fixed within 24 hours of me informing them). I happily built 3-4 8th level characters during the day without any problem, despite the fact I no longer counted as being subscribed to DDI at all.

Please stop spreading misinformation.

Please reread the information. The problem comes when needing to reinstall the software. In your case of course you had no problem because you had no need to reinstall. If however you no longer had an account and did then you would have a problem.

 

[Solodan]

I'm paying for D&D Insider purely for Dragon. The character buildier is delicious frosting on an already substantial cake.

Right now I'm drooling over the fascinating Shadar-kai article - haven't finished it but I'm already looking forward to some of the options available and to further reading...

The fact that later this month I'll be able to use CB software instead of pen and paper is bonus.

Though, if it mattered, I'd rather pay the temporary fee than the one-time model. I know that for a product that is constantly updating, this business model is far more likely to keep the company producing motivated to keep providing the service.

 

[Dire Bare]

I'm fairly confident that D&D 4e and the D&D Insider tools are here to stay for a long time.

But, if WotC decides to stop part or all of the D&D Insider service, I don't think they will "screw" their subscribers. The compendium will be gone, of course (unless they decide to make it a free web app). The other web tools will probably remain on the site for free (unless there is a new edition switch or D&D goes belly up altogether).

You'll get plenty of warning from WotC before the plug is pulled, so you can make sure to download any magazine PDFs that you want and create PDF character sheets of all your favorite characters in the Builder. Heck, it's even possible they'd make the Builder a free app (with no further updates).

It's not like you'll wake up one morning, only to discover D&DI has just disappeared!

The "rental" software model doesn't bother me at all. It makes sense for a software package that is continuously updated with tons of new content each month. And, as others have pointed out, your "rental" fee gets you more than software, it gets you the magazine content monthly as well. I pay "rent" on my antivirus software for regular updates, I also pay "rent" to Microsoft and LiveJournal to keep ads off my personal pages and to get some other perks. As long as the price asked seems reasonable to me versus the services rendered, I'm cool with renting! Oh, yeah, I alternate paying "rent" for World of Warcraft and Lord of the Rings Online too . . .