Yora
Legend
Anyway, I salute Wotc's idea of giving DMs tools for using whatever cosmology they like.
Like in 3rd Edition?
I have to say MotP is the only d20 book I still have other than 3.5e core rulebooks.
Anyway, I salute Wotc's idea of giving DMs tools for using whatever cosmology they like.
Like in 3rd Edition?
I have to say MotP is the only d20 book I still have other than 3.5e core rulebooks.
Huh? There is a page devoted to the Great Ring in the 4e MotP, which also makes it fairly obvious how much of what game before continues into 4e (The Abyss, the Hells, Mt Celestia, Carceri, etc). Not to mention all the Planescape, faction-y stuff (and Sigil itself) popping up all over the 4e planar stuff.I liked 4e's cosmology fine enough, but the idea of burning all that had come before and re-building it from the ground up was very evident there
But it wasn't part of B/X. Nor was it part of Oriental Adventures (which assumed a Celesital Bureaucracy). Nor Krynn (at least in the Dragonlance Adventures incarnation).D&D needs a baseline, for many years the great wheel was that baseline. For many D&D isn't D&D without it.
I think you're right about the Great Wheel, although moreso, I think, as developed by Planescape, than as it appearedin PHB Appendix IV.The cosmologies are about different things. The Great Wheel cosmology is a metaphysical cosmology about Your Place In The Universe. The 4e World Axis Cosmology is about interesting and challenging places to visit.
Yes. I never really understood the rationale for this. (I'm Anglo/Irish-Australian, so some of that slang is part of my childhood vocabulary. What's it doing in Sigil?)One thing I absolutely hated about Planescape was the half-assed cockney rhyming slang ripped off to use in Sigil.
It would similar to a British company making a fantastic world where Bronx slang was used.
What page is the stuff about the pre-4e cosmology? I don't doubt you but I'm not going to read the whole 4e MotP to find it. I do see a section on Sigil but I've played 3.X for many years and never even encountered word one of Sigil so that really doesn't matter to me.Huh? There is a page devoted to the Great Ring in the 4e MotP, which also makes it fairly obvious how much of what game before continues into 4e (The Abyss, the Hells, Mt Celestia, Carceri, etc). Not to mention all the Planescape, faction-y stuff (and Sigil itself) popping up all over the 4e planar stuff.
I did say that it needs a baseline. If you happened to quote a bit more of that paragraph you would have included the part where I said that elves, drow and orcs are all the baseline creatures with baseline alignments. You can THEN vary from that to create something new and those baseline creatures can also be tossed as needed. The same applies to planes, so when you encounter a world that doesn't deal with those planes it is perfectly fine to toss them, but for most games they are going to be present in some form.But it wasn't part of B/X. Nor was it part of Oriental Adventures (which assumed a Celesital Bureaucracy). Nor Krynn (at least in the Dragonlance Adventures incarnation).
The only thing I can think of is some people want a pseudo-industrial citystate to play around in. It is kind of like the Legend of Korra setting, where it is clearly a mishmash of a lot of different cultures in the 1920-1930s most notably New York and Hong Kong (if I remember the press releases correctly). The new vocab might be part of that. A couple posts back someone mentioned it sounding like the Bronx, that is an element of it I think.Yes. I never really understood the rationale for this. (I'm Anglo/Irish-Australian, so some of that slang is part of my childhood vocabulary. What's it doing in Sigil?)
Page 15 sets out the Great Wheel using 4e terminology and tropes. The biggest mechanical changes are making Demons immortal rather than elemental, and adding the ethereal plane.What page is the stuff about the pre-4e cosmology?
Yes. I never really understood the rationale for this. (I'm Anglo/Irish-Australian, so some of that slang is part of my childhood vocabulary. What's it doing in Sigil?)
Yes it is. My point was that, for some of us, that slang (or at least elements of it) are still part of our everyday vocabulary. (A lot of Victorian England criminals found themselves in Australia, after all!)I have no solid evidence, but my thought was Sigil's chant was based on Victorian England criminal slang.