D&D 5E History repeating itself?

[DEFCON 1]

WotC has a horrible track record with these things, so an "all-in" consumer might want to know the answers before buying in.

On the contrary... their track record is about the same for any other rpg company who are popular enough to actually create another edition of their game.

It's the games that don't sell at all that stay with one edition, cause that first one didn't sell well enough to justify making a second one.

 

[Remathilis]

Hell none of the design niggles is news. Habsro's fixin to set D&D up for a fail so it can dump the franchise forever. D&D's been a cash leech and a helluva bad rep for the Hasbro execs, who don't like thinking they make games for freaks, geeks and homos. They's some pretty straitlaced types there, who think making barbies and GI Joes is all Hasbro should be doing. They're gonna dump D&D, mark my words. They're already lining up layoffs for Christmas, and most of the current team's slated to be cut. Insider news.

Please don't be offended when I say "I don't believe you."

There is a new D&D movie in production. There are D&D Herobricks. They are dumping money into the Baldur's Gate redos. D&D isn't a money-loser, though it ain't a cash cow either. It needs just to recoup its costs.

 

[D'karr]

It needs just to recoup its costs.

Actually it needs to make a profit. No business ever produces a long-term product only to recoup the cost of making the product.

 

[Remathilis]

Actually it needs to make a profit. No business ever produces a long-term product only to recoup the cost of making the product.

Magic: The Gathering is printing WotC money nightly. D&D need only be a labor of love that pays its bills.

 

[Raith5]

No.

That said, the 5e playtest didn't look good at first blush, and the iterations I read had no direction or purpose that I could ascertain (cue snarky WotC shill remark about how I could never understand such things because their staff are actual wizards). The good news, as it were, is that there's a lot less good will for them to lose this time.

At this point, there are various D&D-like games out there with decent licenses and better mechanics. People can just check something else out, which didn't really feel like much of an option at the time 4e was announced. The only people WotC can really piss off at this point are the ones who not only play 4e but actually have some substantial investment in its mechanics and conscientiously dislike the new approach.

I like 4th ed and what 4e has added to the history of the game, but I agree. 4th ed went in a direction that was so different in terms of style and mechanics that cant see how it could have easily accommodated a huge percent of 3rd ed fans.

By central response to DDN is that I applaud the process of DDN playtesting and engaging the people who play the game, but so far I cant really see how I can emulate the parts of 4th ed I like the most in DDN. After more than a year of DDN iterations I really thought I would have a greater sense of whether this game is for me!

 

[sidonunspa]

I'm unlikely to be a 5E customer, but those who are should really find out the intentions of the WotC brain trust (however ultimately irrelevant) what the intention is regarding the edition roll out.

How long do they anticipate the edition lasting?
Are they "holding back" anything that some might consider "core" (races, classes, etc.) for future supplements?
Is the plan to roll out an "Essentials" or 3.5 style update once the game has been out 2-3 years?
What type and frequency of adventure support will there be?

The longest WotC has stuck with any single version of D&D rules has been with 3.5 (2003-2008 - although 4E was announced in 2007).

WotC has a horrible track record with these things, so an "all-in" consumer might want to know the answers before buying in.

The same things exists within many other companies.... yes even pathfinder.. just try and play a pathfinder game with the 1st printing of the core book

There has been enough changes you can almost call it pathfinder 1.5

Also let's not fool ourselves, 5e is in development because pathfinder is biting into their sales.

as an aside... I fail to see WHY you dislike 5e so much, I find it's simplicity.. refreshing... and VERY new player friendly without feeling like I'm playing World of Warcraft (apologies to 4e fans)

 

[sidonunspa]

Actually it needs to make a profit. No business ever produces a long-term product only to recoup the cost of making the product.

Seeing I know some sales numbers from distributes... I can safely say you are full of it... D&D 4e sold well.. not gang busters.. but well...

also don't forget their online D&D service numbers... those were very sold

 

[DaveMage]

as an aside... I fail to see WHY you dislike 5e so much, I find it's simplicity.. refreshing... and VERY new player friendly without feeling like I'm playing World of Warcraft (apologies to 4e fans)

I don't dislike 5e - I haven't even looked at it. As I've said in many posts, I'm sure it will be a good game because the designers are good designers.

I just don't need it - I'm happy with what I'm playing now (Pathfinder). I also do not trust WotC's (corporate) handling of the D&D brand. I'm not interested in investing time into learning a game that they are probably going to mothball in a couple of years.

 

[sidonunspa]

I don't dislike 5e - I haven't even looked at it. As I've said in many posts, I'm sure it will be a good game because the designers are good designers.

I just don't need it - I'm happy with what I'm playing now (Pathfinder). I also do not trust WotC's (corporate) handling of the D&D brand. I'm not interested in investing time into learning a game that they are probably going to mothball in a couple of years.

as someone that also played pathfinder.... I'm going to be switching to 5e.

what won me over is the way they are doing minimalist skills and Bounded Accuracy

maybe it's an effect of playing the PFS adventures, but the game has jumped the shark.. when you play a game where you can have have max ranks in a skill (Perception) with a good attribute, skill focus, and eyes of the eagle and still need a 19-20 to spot the ambush... or bump into encounters, regularly, which shut down entire classes.. something has gone honorably wrong.

It's nice to play a game where the next magic item you find can be a "cool one" instead of "damn forget that cloak I need the +3 to all my saves to live though combats"

and get your heads out of the clouds, Piazo is a company, which has a profit margin & employees which are paid well... they see sales drop.. expect a new addition.

Hell I would NOT be surprised if there was one in the works. with the splat books they have created so many rules exceptions that they will, at some point, NEED to clean it all up.

and lets be honest, get the first printing of the PF core book and compare it to the newest printing (6th?) it almost has as many tweaks as 3.0 to 3.5

 

[D'karr]

Seeing I know some sales numbers from distributes... I can safely say you are full of it... D&D 4e sold well.. not gang busters.. but well...

also don't forget their online D&D service numbers... those were very sold

Isn't that exactly what I just said? D&D needs to make a profit, not just recoup it's operational and capital expenses. Whether 4e did so, or not, is neither here nor there. It had nothing to do with what I was discussing. But thanks for your "insight".