D&D 5E Creative solutions to the hypothetical GWF/Sharpshooter issue

[not-so-newguy]

Has anyone messed around with the speed factor variant at all? I dunno what the consensus is on that in terms of how it affects things, I'm guessing someone's done an analysis on it already, but that would be the first thing I'd look at. In general it might be interesting to just do some sort of bonus to initiative for being a fancy duelist without a shield. Not sure if I'm too invested in improving the one-handed-no-shield fighting style though... there's a reason knights usually went sword and board or claymore (or equivalent), historically. The only way I think it could make sense is in combination with some weird AC boosting thing from charisma for looking fancy and having panache, if you're looking for a way to add flavor and mechanics without worrying too much about "realism" (within the context of a typical fantasy world).

I agree on the weapon speed factor idea. Anybody try this yet?

 

[Wulfgar76]

One of the simplest solutions to the issue I've seen is replacing the -5/+10 bullet of both feats with a +1 ability score increase. STR for GWM and DEX for SharpShooter.

 

[Leatherhead]

I take it any existing feats for the other styles are somehow inadequate? Is it just because they can't easily be parsed into DPR?

No, it's because they don't have the "suddenly big number at level 1" effect. The DPR isn't as important (and without Bless it's significantly less than you would think) as seeing that one hit that manages to get 25+ damage when the guy next to you is averaging 8.

In my experience, the Sentinel feat has far more combat impact than GWM. It gives awesome control, in both movement and redirecting damage, and it provides more opportunities for "free" out of turn attacks.

In fact, just direct your shield users to Sentinel.

Two-weapon wielders basically double their damage at level 1 and get to use dex instead of str. Their feat grants +1 ac and +1 average damage on the off hand. Their only issues comes in later when fighters start gaining extra attacks, and suddenly the value of an extra attack for a bonus action becomes relatively less of your overall damage output. Maybe granting advantage or imposing disadvantage when the off-hand attack hits would be a good start. Alternatively you could just slap on an additional off-hand attack when you take the bonus action after level 11.

Duelist seems to be out of place. They get flat damage period and are lackluster out of the gate. I don't think they even get a specific feat. I suppose this is what you pick if you are doing grappling or being an Eldritch Knight. Hey, there is an idea, make it so they get a bonus to their save DC's. It doesn't really benefit Champions, but hey not everything has to work for everyone, just have a niche.

 

[Paraxis]

The best house rule I have seen for this is to not gain your proficiency bonus on the attacks and do damage equal to twice the bonus.

This addresses my major concerns of mitigating wiff factor and damage scaling with level. It is much easier to accept a 1st level human taking a -2 to hit for a +4 to damage, and at very high levels it only goes up to -6 to hit for +12 to damage.

 

[Psikerlord#]

One of the simplest solutions to the issue I've seen is replacing the -5/+10 bullet of both feats with a +1 ability score increase. STR for GWM and DEX for SharpShooter.

This is the solution we use and it works perfectly well, at least for GWM, we dont have sharpshooter. The GWM still does the most damage, just not by a stupid huge margin. The ability to do +10 damage is overkill.

The other alternative, in my view, is to give everyone access to the -5/+10 mechanic as a "called shot" combat option. In this case however the whole party will be doing more damage once bless, magic weapons and other bonuses enter the fray. On the whole the party will benefit more than their enemies, who wont have access to those buffs as often.

Of the two, I prefer solution 1.

 

[Staffan]

Duelist seems to be out of place. They get flat damage period and are lackluster out of the gate. I don't think they even get a specific feat. I suppose this is what you pick if you are doing grappling or being an Eldritch Knight. Hey, there is an idea, make it so they get a bonus to their save DC's. It doesn't really benefit Champions, but hey not everything has to work for everyone, just have a niche.

Nothing prevents a Dueling fighter from wielding a shield, just an off-hand weapon. The way I see it, Dueling is the offensive sword & board option (which makes it a "balanced" option overall - you get the AC bonus of a shield plus some additional damage), while Protection is the tanking option. This would make Sentinel the "advanced Protection" option, and Shield Master the "advanced Dueling" option.

 

[Paraxis]

Polearm master with quarterstaff in one hand and shield in the other is the "advanced dueling" option in my opinion.

Use a shield, get a bonus action staff strike for 1d4+2+str mod, attack of opportunity when creature moves into your reach, lots of extra attacks each getting the +2 dueling modifier.

 

[Staffan]

I meant as in "natural progression from the base level." Great Weapon fighters take Great Weapon Mastery, two-weapon fighters take Dual Wielder, archers take Sharpshooter, and duelists take Shield Master.

 

[Nine Hands]

I would just have .the feats trade disadvantage on the attack roll for advantage on the damage roll. Just roll damage twice, keeping the highest roll.

 

[Paraxis]

I would just have .the feats trade disadvantage on the attack roll for advantage on the damage roll. Just roll damage twice, keeping the highest roll.

Two problems with that.

Risk is not worth the reward, you run a much greater risk of missing and the chance to not do any more damage than if you didn't.

Multiple instances of disadvantage don't stack, this is why the feat as written doesn't impose disadvantage but instead gives a -5 penalty, with this house rule fix you would always take the disadvantage when you already have disadvantage on the attack.