D&D 5E Eberron popularity in 5E

[Bolares]

I think an even bigger, probably more fundamental, divergence here is in the last sentence. Keith Baker has been pretty explicit in his statements that PCs are supposed to be the ones to create the cool stories. In general, there's a dearth of NPC factions that can ally with the PCs in order to accomplish their goals, or that are, in general, actively working to oppose the setting's big bads. Eberron's general design expectation is that the setting does NOT exist in some sort of stasis; if an NPC starts a world-destroying plot, there's no good guy group opposing them to stop it, and only the PCs can stop it form happening.

More so that most settings, Eberron is actively designed with the idea that PCs won't stay within the boundaries of the setting. The mystery of the Mournland is MEANT to be solved. Vol is designed to be opposed and eventually defeated. The Last War is supposed to start up again (or possibly, Galifar is meant to be reunited.) il-Lashtavar is supposed to be replaced by il-Yannah. Riedra should be liberated. The settings books don't tell you how that's going to be accomplished because it wants the players and the DM to do it themselves.

That's what I was trying to say, but in my lack of practice in writing in english made it harder. hahaha

 

[TwoSix]

That's what I was trying to say, but in my lack of practice in writing in english made it harder. hahaha

No worries, always glad to help out a fellow Eberron lover.

 

[delericho]

In this case, the breakdown is that novels don't actually have PC-equivalent characters, not even among the protagonists

The protagonists of an RPG are the PCs. The protagonists of the Harry Potter stories are Harry, Ron, and Hermoine.

If S.P.E.W. is an example of what you want, I suggest you speak to your players.

 

[AaronOfBarbaria]

The protagonists of an RPG are the PCs. The protagonists of the Harry Potter stories are Harry, Ron, and Hermoine.

That you think you are saying something that is in conflict with the statements I've made regarding Protagonist of novel =/= PC-equivalent character, is proof of the breakdown to which I was referring.

 

[delericho]

That you think you are saying something that is in conflict with the statements I've made regarding Protagonist of novel =/= PC-equivalent character, is proof of the breakdown to which I was referring.

Ah, I see. Your analogies are good, but anyone else's are void. It would save time if you'd just said that up front.

 

[AaronOfBarbaria]

Keith Baker has been pretty explicit in his statements that PCs are supposed to be the ones to create the cool stories.

Sure, and he presented quite a number of things as being seeds to those cool stories - Like how the Mournland is actually addressed as being mysterious rather than just some completely normal place between Thrane and the Talenta Planes, or how Vol is actually addressed as being a vengeful undead monster rather than just being some unexplained example of a lich with a name, or how any of the other details you mentioned are presented as something besides a matter of fact with no particular attention paid to how people in-setting general view it or feel about it.

That elementals are bound is presented in the way that the buildings in Sharn being made of stone is presented, which is to say that it is presented as if it isn't of any consequence to anyone's campaign beyond just being there so that an answer of some kind is present should anyone happen to ask.

 

[Cap'n Kobold]

Regarding the issue of bound elementals, bear in mind that not that many people actually know how elemental binding is achieved, and the only people who perform it are Gnomes, generally working in a government or commercial association with House Cannith. Most people probably don't know that elementals are actually sentient beings in their own right, or that the binding probably isn't a fair exchange, or simply don't stop and consider the implications.

Secondly, there actually is a group opposing the slavery of bound elementals. They're called the Power of Purity, detailed in Magic of Eberron. This group of mostly gnomes are a growing part of the binding industry and negotiate with elementals beforehand.

 

[kbrakke]

Going back to the OP which is the popularity of Eberron in 5e.
The lack of new books does not help Eberron grow, but if you want to play Eberron in 5e it's pretty easy. PHB + UA/Playtest + 3.5 books has been working just fine for me. For me the most interesting stories are exploring Xen'Drik, Droaam becoming a real nation, unrest between the nations with the war just being over, and the advancing of technology. I think psionics and the artificer are cool, but am not compelled to fully brew that up for my players. It was probably even easier for me because the players were new to Eberron. They didn't even think they could be an artificer or psion. If those options being available for the players are an essential part of Eberron to you, then it would be hard, I agree. However if you want to use the setting, there isn't much that you really need to add.

With the aspects of the world I wanted to explore, and based on my player's expectations I was able to easily start a game. The story that emerged feels like Eberron to me, and I don't think it would work on any other world based solely on my playing a lot of FR from the published adventures, and reading the Dragonlance Novels.

As for what I think is an honestly confusing aside about the setting: I'm not mad if the setting mentions something but doesn't go in to deep detail, and then you find it interesting. There are so many single sentence hooks littered through out a campaign setting book that it's just not possible to flesh all of them out. If you played a campaign with every single partially mentioned interesting thing as a plot point, you would get stuck in a never ending chain of major quests. It's up to the DM to emphasize certain parts of it, and it's up to the player to either latch on to those, or explore themselves to indicate to the DM what they want to do in the world. With this specific example if a player asked more in detail about the Elementals we could explore that. If I didn't own Magic of Eberron and didn't know about that shift in gnome philosophy they might be inclined to make their own liberation group.

Actually something like this happened. One player has been dead set on warforged rights and equal opportunity. We had a solid arc with them using their large amounts of money from adventuring setting up schooling and scholarships for warforged. They did this in tandem with the d'Cannith family who felt it would be a great PR stunt in the fairly liberal Breland in addition to a lot of things that I don't need to go in to. They got to deal with riots, protesters, undercover thugs trying to destabilize things, some unsavory types coming their defense and a whole host of other exciting things. I remember in the Sharn City of Towers book them describing how people protest the warforged, but I didn't see anything about groups seeking to rectify it. Which again, not something I'm surprised at. The sentence "People protest the warforged's existence" was enough for me the DM to expand on that in make this an issue in our Eberron.

TL;DR - an Elemental Evil Player's Companion sized pdf would be sufficient for new players being brought to Eberron. If you want to play Eberron just don't be an artificer or a psion, there are enough versions of the more common races(Warforged, Changeling, Shifter) that the PCs have enough options there. If you really think the PCs MUST be one of the things that doesn't have official support yet then you will be waiting a long time. But I really don't think the players getting to use those options is essential for a true Eberron campaign.

 

[AaronOfBarbaria]

Regarding the issue of bound elementals, bear in mind that not that many people actually know how elemental binding is achieved, and the only people who perform it are Gnomes, generally working in a government or commercial association with House Cannith. Most people probably don't know that elementals are actually sentient beings in their own right, or that the binding probably isn't a fair exchange, or simply don't stop and consider the implications.

A detail that is functionally no different from a not-detail likely should remain a not-detail on purpose to give the word count that would be spent detailing exactly what it is that not many people actually know to something which most people do know, or at least something that is framed to encourage DMs to focus a campaign or adventure upon it.

And the idea that most people don't know that elementals are actually sentient in the setting that involves an entire sub-heading under the heading "What Every Adventure Needs" dedicated to the topic of painting the world in shades of grey, rather than black and white, because a red dragon can be noble and heroic while a silver dragon is a despicable villain, doesn't sit right with me as a reason why there aren't people that do know that elementals aren't willingly hired to help out on airships, and have no confirmation that they are sentient but act on the suspicion alone to try and free these elementals because if they are sentient (and in a world were basically everything else is, why wouldn't they be) they are likely not happy.

Secondly, there actually is a group opposing the slavery of bound elementals. They're called the Power of Purity, detailed in Magic of Eberron. This group of mostly gnomes are a growing part of the binding industry and negotiate with elementals beforehand.

Now, see, that is cool that at whatever point along the product run that book came out someone at least addressed that someone might not be entirely cool with what is being done to the elementals. It's just too bad there wasn't a memorable line in the original setting book (the only one I've actually owned and read through) to the effect of "...but not everyone that knows how these airships operate thinks using elementals in this way is acceptable." Didn't even have to be really detailed, just provide the idea that there is some conflict of opinion on the topic.

Now that you've told me about this, though, I plan on seeing if any of my Eberron-liking buddies have a copy of Magic of Eberron that I could borrow for a read.

 

[AverageCitizen]

I've even seen people avoid Eberron and claim the reason as being the inclusion of this or that element that is actually also included in their setting of choice, and they take no issue or ignore it there but hold it against Eberron (airships, as an example).

Not that there aren't any valid reasons to not like Eberron, because their are (going back to airships, even, I dislike how Eberron airships are made to function by extraplanar slavery, and prefer airships - which I adore - to have methods of lift/propulsion that are either entirely technological like steam-engines and giant balloons, or which use magic in a way other than binding unwilling elemental creatures and acting like there is no moral issue there because, I guess, "Fire ain't people, no matter whether it can have philosophical conversation on that topic or not.") ...and I'm ranting, sorry - my point was to say that there are valid reasons to not like Eberron, whole or in part, but that a staggering percentage of people that express dislike for Eberron cite nonsensical reasons instead.

Yeah, I think you are right. People don't always understand or articulate their motives for great reasons.

PS> I always assumed elementals don't care. If a fire gets to burn, he is fine. They just are.