D&D 5E Dragon Fire - the Drogon Initiative

[dave2008]

Couldn't you simply have the dragon create areas that are on fire as Iserith suggested, and deal 1d10 damage to any creature that ends their turn in that area? And every time a creature takes fire damage from the dragon (directly or indirectly), they automatically catch fire (if they wear flammable fabrics), which can be extinguished by spending an action to extinguish the flames. You don't need to be carrying gallons of water, you just need to roll on the ground a bit, and do your best to douse the flames. The target then take 1d10 fire damage each round until the fire is extinguished.

Yes you could and I think that is closer to a general rule for 5e, but I am specifically looking for something more.

Hmmm, that is not what I intended with the water comment. The intent was that you could be doused with water or take an action and make a save to extinguish the flames. The water is not required, but if have it, it is a get a jail free card.

By the way, 6d6 seems like a bit much for just being on fire. Are the players being hit with dragon fire, or being dowsed with napalm?

Magical naplam, yes that is the effect I was going for. I guess I hit right on Obviously the damage amount could be changed. But I prefer terrifying amounts of damage.

Breath weapons are plenty scary as is. No need to increase the damage that much.

I disagree. For an ancient red I typical raise the average damage so that it would reduce a wizard without resistance, and that fails a save, to 0 HP. This revision is actually a little kinder as you probably keep the 91 fire damage of the MM instead of the 150 +/- fire damage I normally use.

 

[dave2008]

I thought that scene from the show was a good example of HP. Hopefully this doesn't spoil things but oh well, I'm not smart enough to figure out how the spoiler tags work anymore. When Bronn is on the scorpion and Drogon breathes at him he leaps aside and ends up in the embers of the blast. He really got hit for say 58 damage but he had 75 HP and that was an example of his luck and skill and all those things that go into HP in action.

p.s. are there spoiler tags anymore?

Spoiler

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I agree - same with Jamie's charge. Yes, there are spoiler tags, but instead of

Spoiler

it is [sblock]

 

[dave2008]

I see. I guess you could just write the mechanic as:

The dragon exhales fire in a 90-foot cone. Each creature in the area must make a DC 24 Dexterity saving throw, taking 91 (26d6) fire damage or half as much damage on a successful one. A creature that fails its save takes an additional 21 (6d6) fire damage at the start of its next turn and then takes an action to put out the flames.

That's much easier.

Yes, but I don't want to force them to take the action. In theory if the have resistance they could withstand the attack for a bit and someone could use magic or water to douse them. Your version is simpler, but not better IMO for creating the full range of effects I am going for.

 

[dave2008]

Assuming "direct hit" means a failed Dex save, 18d6 fire damage from an Adult Red Dragon is a pretty serious consequence for most PCs.

If you look I specifically used the ancient red dragon stats. I really only see this being added to the most powerful dragons. Perhaps an adult as a lesser version, or nothing additional at all.

 

[dave2008]

All my dragons that do fire damage do fire damage. It that fire hits a flammable surface, it ignites. So, fighting a fire-breathing dragon on some rocks won't do anything. Fighting a fire-breathing dragon on the plains creates a brushfire. Since players are flammable they take XdY ongoing damage per turn where X is the dragon's age and Y is the die-type that breath weapon uses. In exchange, the initial damage is reduced. Brushfires created by dragonfire deal XdY damage to anyone caught in them until they are extinguished.

Acid-breathing dragons have the same effect, except their breath always creates difficult terrain (pools of acid) until extinguished.

For that silly green dragon who breathes the one weird type of damage, they create a poison cloud that moves it's length each round for X rounds where X is the dragon's age category. The cloud always deals full breath weapon damage.

Dragons that don't do ongoing damage (like lightning) get increased direct-damage damage and players wearing metal have disadvantage on saves.

As CapnZapp also suggests, my dragons can also "paint" their attacks, but I also let dragons choose if they breathe a cone or a line, or if they use all the dice of their breath and can use some of it the next round without needing a recharge.

Dragons are, on the whole, very weak opponents in 5E. They deal very little damage without their breath which is more or less an "alpha strike" that if they flub means they're gonna die.

I like a lot of these suggestions, I think I will use them. The one difference I would have is that the rocks would still catch fire as I see the dragon fire as a magical napalm that sticks to things. So even on rock it creates a zone.

 

[Grazzt]

After watching the latest GoT episode it got me thinking about dragon fire. One thing I really liked was the continuing chaos and damage caused by the dragon fire after the initial attack. In 4e I got tired of so many monsters inflicting ongoing damage, so I started dropping it from my monsters designs. However, after seeing the episode I really want to bring it back with a vengeance (for ancient dragons at least). What do you think?

How about:
Fire Breath (Recharge 5-6). The dragon exhales fire in a 90-foot cone. Each creature in the area must make a DC 24 Dexterity saving throw, taking 91 (26d6) fire damage and is ignited on a failed save, or half as much damage on a successful one. A creature or object ignited by dragon fire cannot take reactions, has disadvantage on its attacks and concentration checks, and takes 21 (6d6) fire damage at the start of each of its turns until it is extinguished. An ignited creature or object can be extinguished with the equivalent of 5 gallons of water or by taking an action and a successful DC 15 Dexterity saving throw to extinguish the flames.

This, I think, begins to model the effects produced by Drogon in "The Spoils of War." Any suggestions.

If you really want to go GoT/ASoIaF, then dragon's fire can be extinguished by water, but only if fully submerged. Otherwise, it keeps burning, kinda like napalm (or wildfire in GoT lore).

 

[dave2008]

For me, it's definitely the rape (which, from what I've heard, the show has far less of than the books did).

I remember reading that when you originally posted it. Incredibly disturbing. I can't believe someone did it, and then that no one said anything about it.

I have two sons, and one of my biggest fears is that they would sit on the side lines and not act in such a situation. I have tried to tell them to always stick up for what is right, don't take a back seat. I had them train in martial arts so they could protect themselves and more importantly others ( and studies have shown that those who are confident in there physical abilities are more likely to act and help others in danger). I wondered how it was working until we we drove 8 hours to participate in the Women's march in DC. The moment was transformational for my older son and I am sure he will stick up for those in need when he can. So sorry for your experience.

 

[dave2008]

I get that. And I'm sorry if I came off as hostile. I didn't intend to. But GoT is practically everywhere (especially with the recently leaked episode), and it's hard to find a moment where people aren't talking about it. It's like trying to avoid politics in November.

Edit: Also, to be fair, I did actually talk about the subject you mentioned and didn't just complain about GoT being mentioned.

No worries, i didn't think you were being hostile. I'm pretty easy going, even if I thought you were hostile I would understand - its not everyone's cup of tea.

Yes, sorry I didn't respond to the rest, but we seemed to be on similar wavelength so I did not feel the need to.

 

[dave2008]

If you really want to go GoT/ASoIaF, then dragon's fire can be extinguished by water, but only if fully submerged. Otherwise, it keeps burning, kinda like napalm (or wildfire in GoT lore).

Yes, that is the idea I'm going for

 

[Ristamar]

Instead of trying to rebalance the direct breath weapon damage with ongoing damage, you could allow the dragon to instantly spend Legendary actions to add a lingering damage effect just before it breathes. In essence, you'd just be shifting its action economy to the breath weapon given comparable expected average damage.