Ability Score Rebalancing

[DND_Reborn]

I wanted to add - penalizing a language when negative INT or extra languages when high int isn’t going to change whether someone dumps int or not

it might make a few go to 10 int instead of 8. But then they are just putting the 8 in str or cha or wisdom or dex.

True. No matter what priorities you assign to different ability scores, certain classes will nearly always favor dumping into particular ability scores. If you want to be good in fighting, you will favor physical stats, if you want to be good in social, you'll favor the mental ones, if you want to be good at exploration, you'll likely favor a balance IMO.

But other than for role-playing, you'll rarely find a super-smart fighter, with something like STR 12, DEX 12, CON 10, INT 17, WIS 14, CHR 12. That is why for experienced players, I prefer rolling scores and doing so IN ORDER. You play what you get. If you want a fighter, play a smart and wise fighter. Or maybe play an intelligent battle-priest?

 

[FrogReaver]

Nit it to mention when you try to buff a stat it essential gives any class that relays on that stat as a primary a huge buff as well

True. No matter what priorities you assign to different ability scores, certain classes will nearly always favor dumping into particular ability scores. If you want to be good in fighting, you will favor physical stats, if you want to be good in social, you'll favor the mental ones, if you want to be good at exploration, you'll likely favor a balance IMO.

But other than for role-playing, you'll rarely find a super-smart fighter, with something like STR 12, DEX 12, CON 10, INT 17, WIS 14, CHR 12. That is why for experienced players, I prefer rolling scores and doing so IN ORDER. You play what you get. If you want a fighter, play a smart and wise fighter. Or maybe play an intelligent battle-priest?

 

[FrogReaver]

Nit it to mention when you try to buff a stat it essential gives any class that relays on that stat as a primary a huge buff as well

True. No matter what priorities you assign to different ability scores, certain classes will nearly always favor dumping into particular ability scores. If you want to be good in fighting, you will favor physical stats, if you want to be good in social, you'll favor the mental ones, if you want to be good at exploration, you'll likely favor a balance IMO.

But other than for role-playing, you'll rarely find a super-smart fighter, with something like STR 12, DEX 12, CON 10, INT 17, WIS 14, CHR 12. That is why for experienced players, I prefer rolling scores and doing so IN ORDER. You play what you get. If you want a fighter, play a smart and wise fighter. Or maybe play an intelligent battle-priest?

 

[RhaezDaevan]

Intelligence bonus should give more tool proficiencies and/or languages.

Wisdom bonus could give "inherent insight" into their decision making. Each plus is used to ask the DM whether something will work, or if there's a suprise waiting for them if they attempt something, before committing to an action. Once used, they would be gone, though I could see a refresh at some point.

Charisma bonus could have worked with a reputation system, but lacking that, it could give free "favors" with NPCs that could be cashed in during the adventure. Probably only one use per plus, but perhaps they could refresh every few level-ups.

What comes to mind for the Wisdom and Charimsa benefits to refresh, is when proficiency bonus improves, but it would obviously need play testing to see if that's too powerful.

Please, someone take these ideas and run with them like a fun pair of scissors.

 

[FrogReaver]

True. No matter what priorities you assign to different ability scores, certain classes will nearly always favor dumping into particular ability scores. If you want to be good in fighting, you will favor physical stats, if you want to be good in social, you'll favor the mental ones, if you want to be good at exploration, you'll likely favor a balance IMO.

But other than for role-playing, you'll rarely find a super-smart fighter, with something like STR 12, DEX 12, CON 10, INT 17, WIS 14, CHR 12. That is why for experienced players, I prefer rolling scores and doing so IN ORDER. You play what you get. If you want a fighter, play a smart and wise fighter. Or maybe play an intelligent battle-priest?

I also wanted to say that you have found the only other workable solution to having fighters in 5e not dump int. Some variation of roll in order or mostly roll in order.

Maybe even a heres the standard array - roll a d6 to see what position on the array aligns with what stat.

Also swap 1 at the end is generally a good idea with such a method.

The only alternative is to is to make int based subclasses etc for all classes. Possibly even a few more int classes could help as you can’t dump int to multiclass into a class with int

 

[FrogReaver]

One fun perk to give to int might be a deduction skill “Sherlock Holmes skill” where you can roll to see if you figured something out that you didn’t previously know based on what appears to everyone else to be unimportant information.

 

[DND_Reborn]

I also wanted to say that you have found the only other workable solution to having fighters in 5e not dump int. Some variation of roll in order or mostly roll in order.

Maybe even a heres the standard array - roll a d6 to see what position on the array aligns with what stat.

Also swap 1 at the end is generally a good idea with such a method.

The only alternative is to is to make int based subclasses etc for all classes. Possibly even a few more int classes could help as you can’t dump int to multiclass into a class with int

When I do use rolling in order, I generally allow 7 rolls and the player can remove one. The rest shift positions to fill up the gap.

Sometimes I allow players to subtract up to 3 points from one stat to add the same number to another.

For example: 13, 7, 15, 11, 10, 12, 16

The player removes the 7 and would have 13, 15, 11, 10, 12, 16.

If you add the second option, he might remove 3 from the 16 and add it to the 11, resulting in 13, 15, 14, 10, 12, 13.

Would make a nice character IMO. Oddly enough, the 10 ended up in INT LOL!

 

[Yaarel]

The absent minded professor springs to mind

The absent minded professor is misunderstood. Its not that they cant keep track of social events or clothing fashions, its that they dont care. They are busy doing other things that are more interesting to them.

In any case, they have high skill bonuses, not necessarily high ability bonuses.

 

[Xeviat]

Pointing out checking on who will benefit from added abilities is a good way to make sure it isn't powering up the wrong characters.

But, the big point is to make it so characters feel having a low stat, and to carefully consider which stat they dump.

Intelligence feels like the stat that is easiest to dump because the skills it is associated with are very active and they're very party wide. You only need one person to make that investigation or arcana check.

 

[FrogReaver]

The absent minded professor is misunderstood. Its not that they cant keep track of social events

I would say that’s exactly what it is - that such a person can't keep track of social events

or clothing fashions, its that they dont care.

now you are just explaining why they can’t do those things.

They are busy doing other things that are more interesting to them.

yes, that’s why we call them absent minded. That’s why they can’t keep track of social events or fashions.

More importantly though, absent minded isn’t so much about not keeping track of fashion or social events. Absent minded is a marked distractedness from what is currently going on around you. Typically because you are very focused on something you find more important or interesting. That’s absent minded. Such a character is inherently not perceptive - not aware of their surroundings.

In any case, they have high skill bonuses, not necessarily high ability bonuses.

That’s not true in the case of their perception - which is what my comment about the absent minded professor was actually about - someone proposed changing perception to be an int skill and I was explaining why that doesn’t make sense