New Rise of Skywalker trailer

[Istbor]

Maybe but we don't know that for sure. We do know about Han and Leia's relationship and they had a kid as well.

All they had to do was use the OT characters to get the new ones over and pass the torch.

They tried that in the wrong way by undermining the old ones while kind of failing to pass the torch. I suppose they ham fisted it by literally passing the lightsaber and blaster. Subtle as brick in face, just make Han a dead beat dad and revert his character development in the OT.

If I was writing it I would have had a female Jedi lead, killed off Han but I would have given the OT characters a reunion, a somewhat happy ending, and used Hand death to get Kylo over.

Same thing with Luke, if you kill him off do it in the 3rd movie.

Having a plan whatever the story was going to be would also help.

Whoa! Who said anything about Han being a deadbeat dad!? As you point out, we don't know anything about how Kylo was raised. We are told Snoke had influence on him, and was sent to Luke's academy to try and end that influence. We don't know whether he was in some sort of broken home, or loving family however. Certainly Han seemed to feel some amount of guilt or as if he had failed as a father.

I am not sure how it would affect me if my only son became and evil bastard, and I blame myself or whoever? We don't know. Han and Leia clearly are dealing with this probably complex scenario in their own ways.

To me, Han fell back into his old ways because they were familiar, nostalgic. Less likely to remind himself of failing as a father or the loss of his his son. It isn't uncommon for couples who have lost children to separate, simply because it is too painful to have a constant reminder of that pain right there.

And why was Kylo unable to force block/deflect/freeze Chewie's fire? I'd say because he just killed his dad. As we learn, it tore him up inside. Heck, he couldn't even kill his mother, and you are thinking he should have been able to kill his dad in front of her?

I think you want a villain who is all evil. No chance for redemption. Instead we have one that is decidedly human. Has emotions, has loved ones that they care about. Heck, even Vader didn't kill his own family as cold-blooded as you want Kylo to behave.

He paused, he watched as Luke was being fried by force lightning and he decided that he wouldn't be that man.

I think Kylo is as compelling of a character as Vader turned out to be. Just different. It would be boring if we just got another star wars villain who is decidedly evil. Through and through.

 

[Umbran]

Make it a bit different from the others.

The pattern "He wins, they tie, she wins" is so... pat and neat as to be nearly cliche, and not particularly compelling. "I gained power and finally beat you," isn't an interesting plotline.

More broadly, the fights are great tension, but the pattern of who wins which one is not something I'm invested in. I care more about why they fight, and what happens as a result of their conflicts, than exactly who wins when.

Remember - Luke brings about the fall of Vader and Palpatine after the fighting was done and over with - he lost the lightsaber battle, but won the real, important conflict, which was not one of martial prowess.

 

[Zardnaar]

Whoa! Who said anything about Han being a deadbeat dad!? As you point out, we don't know anything about how Kylo was raised. We are told Snoke had influence on him, and was sent to Luke's academy to try and end that influence. We don't know whether he was in some sort of broken home, or loving family however. Certainly Han seemed to feel some amount of guilt or as if he had failed as a father.

I am not sure how it would affect me if my only son became and evil bastard, and I blame myself or whoever? We don't know. Han and Leia clearly are dealing with this probably complex scenario in their own ways.

To me, Han fell back into his old ways because they were familiar, nostalgic. Less likely to remind himself of failing as a father or the loss of his his son. It isn't uncommon for couples who have lost children to separate, simply because it is too painful to have a constant reminder of that pain right there.

And why was Kylo unable to force block/deflect/freeze Chewie's fire? I'd say because he just killed his dad. As we learn, it tore him up inside. Heck, he couldn't even kill his mother, and you are thinking he should have been able to kill his dad in front of her?

I think you want a villain who is all evil. No chance for redemption. Instead we have one that is decidedly human. Has emotions, has loved ones that they care about. Heck, even Vader didn't kill his own family as cold-blooded as you want Kylo to behave.

He paused, he watched as Luke was being fried by force lightning and he decided that he wouldn't be that man.

I think Kylo is as compelling of a character as Vader turned out to be. Just different. It would be boring if we just got another star wars villain who is decidedly evil. Through and through.

I wouldn't make Kylo unredeemable. But Rey just met Han and he wasn't her uncle. Han dying

I wouldn't have Kylo do the redemption thing a'la Vader. Maybe with a twist like a double turn.

He might kill Han in front of Leia but wouldn't kill Leia like TLJ.

Disney had the right ingredients but they missed a few, didn't have a recipe and over used some they did have.

You would have to play it safe with VII regardless. Lightsabers, X Wings, Jedi.

I wouldn't go out of my way to antagonize fans and it's obvious what would do it like treating the OT characters badly. You need a little bit of fan service which TFA had a lot of.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

^I know it isn't Taoist philosophy, but it has shades of it - thus "quasi-Taoist leanings."

But it also isn't the strongly dualistic Abrahamic Good vs. Evil that you imply.

I didn't imply anything Abrahamic at all. The Force is part of nature, the Dark Side is a cancer. That's been canon since the start.

 

[Umbran]

I didn't imply anything Abrahamic at all. The Force is part of nature, the Dark Side is a cancer. That's been canon since the start.

Ehhh. While Episodes 4, 5, and 6 imply this (but don't actually state it directly), the rest of the material is not so clear on that point. There's a lot of philosophy about the Force, and not all of it is so black and white. Traditional Jedi may say it was so, but is that The Truth, or merely the philosophy used to keep a large group of force users under control?

 

[Mercurius]

I didn't imply anything Abrahamic at all. The Force is part of nature, the Dark Side is a cancer. That's been canon since the start.

Ehhh. While Episodes 4, 5, and 6 imply this (but don't actually state it directly), the rest of the material is not so clear on that point. There's a lot of philosophy about the Force, and not all of it is so black and white. Traditional Jedi may say it was so, but is that The Truth, or merely the philosophy used to keep a large group of force users under control?

I'm no Star Wars expert, but my sense of it is that Force philosophy is rather messy and often contradictory, with a variety of possible interpretations (sort of like real life). I don't know if there is a singular canonical interpretation, but could be wrong.

I like what Umbran says here, that the Jedi have their own interpretation which they view as canon. I'd love to see SW explore other "Force Paradigms" beyond the Jedi-Sith.

 

[Istbor]

I wouldn't make Kylo unredeemable. But Rey just met Han and he wasn't her uncle. Han dying

I wouldn't have Kylo do the redemption thing a'la Vader. Maybe with a twist like a double turn.

He might kill Han in front of Leia but wouldn't kill Leia like TLJ.

Disney had the right ingredients but they missed a few, didn't have a recipe and over used some they did have.

You would have to play it safe with VII regardless. Lightsabers, X Wings, Jedi.

I wouldn't go out of my way to antagonize fans and it's obvious what would do it like treating the OT characters badly. You need a little bit of fan service which TFA had a lot of.

I don't understand your first thought/sentence at all.

Especially, "But Rye just met Han and he wasn't her uncle. Han dying".

What is that? What does meeting Han have to do with him being her uncle. And then just, Han dying. Like from old age? Boring.

 

[Zardnaar]

I don't understand your first thought/sentence at all.

Especially, "But Rye just met Han and he wasn't her uncle. Han dying".

What is that? What does meeting Han have to do with him being her uncle. And then just, Han dying. Like from old age? Boring.

Lol distracted and didn't finish it.

Han and Rey didn't have a strong relationship or even an implied one like Luke had with Uncle Ben.

I think Kylo killing Han in front if Leia would have meant more especially if they were still together.

A reunion of some sort between the 3 onscreen should have also been done IMHO.

Luke sitting on an island failing is also a silly idea, they could have put him somewhere else out of the way.

They sort of undid the OT and made the characters look like jobbers to try and get the new lot over with the fans.

It didn't seem to work out so well. Toy sales, polling at Star Wars.com, online reactions etc.

They built a billion dollar theme park and didn't put any OT stuff in it lol.

Geniuses.

 

[trappedslider]

Some Star Wars conservationists suggest a more extreme approach, that Star Wars should abandon all attempts at re-invention and instead cater exclusively to the old-school fanbase. Though attractive, this approach may prove impractical as a long-term solution.

 

[Hussar]

/snip

It didn't seem to work out so well. Toy sales, polling at Star Wars.com, online reactions etc.

They built a billion dollar theme park and didn't put any OT stuff in it lol.

Geniuses.

Wait, what? There's a giant Millennium Falcon right in the middle of that park? Oh, right, it's got a square deflector dish, so it's not OT? GImme a break.

Toy sales are down. Yeah, there's a shock. A fifty year old property that's popular with aging men isn't selling as well anymore. It's cyclical. It happens.

But, for me, I rather hope that DIsney continues to give a giant middle finger to the "fans" because they are making better movies that I want to see. Let the fanbois fall off the face of the earth and let the rest of us enjoy something in peace.