D&D General How do you like your ASIs?

[Maxperson]

For the fighter.

As others have pointed out, stats control more than just raw numbers for the better designed classes.

Yes. They provide small bonuses in other areas as well.

 

[Vaalingrade]

Yes. They provide small bonuses in other areas as well.

Like entire daily uses of key abilities in a system that drip-feeds everything including ability usage.

 

[Bill Zebub]

Like entire daily uses of key abilities in a system that drip-feeds everything including ability usage.

That is shifting to proficiency bonus instead of attribute. Hopefully the anniversary/5.5 edition will update the older classes/subclasses.

 

[clearstream]

Yes?

In a desire for players to succeed (forgiving mechanics, high success rate) and nostalgic appeal, they provide basic tropes, and examples that make things as easy on new players as possible.

Is a Tiefling Barbarian unsupported?

I think if the contention is that the designers did not foresee that player characters would have 16 in their key abilities, that is very much not evidenced by their choice of example, which has 16+ in both its key abilities.

 

[Maxperson]

That is shifting to proficiency bonus instead of attribute. Hopefully the anniversary/5.5 edition will update the older classes/subclasses.

If that's true(not doubting you, I just haven't seen it myself), then that's just more proof that they didn't intent ability scores to have to be high(16+).

 

[Scribe]

I think if the contention is that the designers did not foresee that player characters would have 16 in their key abilities, that is very much not evidenced by their choice of example, which has 16+ in both its key abilities.

My proposal isn't that a 16 is unanticipated.

My question is, is the 14 or 15 insufficient for the challenges the player will face.

Because if so, and clearly designed by Wizards as such, many race/class combos would be invalidated.

It's like at my company. If a client finds a way to use the software, but it's unintended, is it supported, or will it cause problems?

Can I play a Tiefling Barbarian with Standard Array (unintended?) or will it cause problems?

 

[Maxperson]

Can I play a Tiefling Barbarian with Standard Array (unintended?) or will it cause problems?

That had to assume that all race/class combos would be played and set the game to that baseline. That means that with the standard array, 15(+2) is the highest stat they could assume. The few examples in the books of NPCs with 16+ as the main do not prove otherwise.

 

[Scribe]

That had to assume that all race/class combos would be played and set the game to that baseline. That means that with the standard array, 15(+2) is the highest stat they could assume. The few examples in the books of NPCs with 16+ as the main do not prove otherwise.

That's the assumption I'm at.

 

[Lyxen]

That had to assume that all race/class combos would be played and set the game to that baseline. That means that with the standard array, 15(+2) is the highest stat they could assume. The few examples in the books of NPCs with 16+ as the main do not prove otherwise.

Another way to look at it is the fact that no-one ever complains about the Encounter calculator providing encounters that are way more deadly to a party than computed. It's always the other way around, encounters are actually considered easier than computed, and people are bragging about needing Deadly x3 to challenge their groups. Usually, the reason is that the characters are using options that make them extra powerful, but another conclusion is that, in general, the encounter calculator is based on standard array non-optimised characters of random class/race combo.

 

[Bill Zebub]

If that's true(not doubting you, I just haven't seen it myself), then that's just more proof that they didn't intent ability scores to have to be high(16+).

No, it is not “proof” of any such thing. It is evidence that they might (probably?) have recently been thinking that primary attributes have too much weight.

It could possibly also be the result of what you are suggesting. But if so one would wonder why it took them so long. So I don’t find that argument compelling.