D&D 5E The Quest to Reduce "Sameyness" (+)

[ECMO3]

You would need to stop the design introduced in 4E that every class must be equally good at combat and go back to 2E where there were classes which were better in combat and other which were better at something else.
If 5E can even handle "something else", considering how gutted everything besides combat is.

5E does not have this. In terms of classes Rogues and Monks are behind the others in combat and if you choose the wrong subclass you are way behind.

Rogues and Monks are not as far behind fighters/warriers than they were in 1E/2E, but they are still behind.

I disagree completely about "something else" being gutted in 5E. With backgrounds, tool proficiencies and a variety of skills I find the mechanics in 5E to have the most "something else" of any edition, with Rogues as a class also being the best at this "something else" to make up for their below average combat abilities (Monks have no such save).

Some tables don't use those mechanics and on you tube and message boards combat dominates posts, but the designers did include it in the game, and they include it in their published adventures too. The WBW campaign can actually be completed without any combat at all ..... which must suck if you chose to play a blaster mage or a battlemaster.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

How’s that been working out?

I think this change should make sorceres a real force to be reckoned with.

In our games sorcerers already went for con over charisma. If you specialize in twinned concentration buff or debuff spells, con is the actual main stat as you really want to never lose concentration.

With only con as casting stat, you are all in one caster and have spare points for dexterity too.

 

[DEFCON 1]

Nothing wrong with playing Basic Rules Core Four if that's what you and your players are into. That's why WotC produced it.

But there's also nothing wrong with opening up options and subclasses to do or allow for several different roles, so that any party can cover most roles regardless of what classes players end up wanting to play. That way no one is forced to be a Cleric healer (for example) if they do not want to.

It just means that the DM and players who believe there is too much sameyness have to agree on which books / sections / classes / subclasses they are going to allow to be used. Hopefully there can be.

 

[DND_Reborn]

But there's also nothing wrong with opening up options and subclasses to do or allow for several different roles, so that any party can cover most roles regardless of what classes players end up wanting to play. That way no one is forced to be a Cleric healer (for example) if they do not want to.

(bold added)

See, this is one thing I just never understood or agreed with. I don't feel there is really any role that HAS to be filled by the party. Even in AD&D, we played different games with all wizards, all thieves, and all fighters. With easy/fast healing in 5E, this is even less of an issue IMO.

 

[DEFCON 1]

(bold added)

See, this is one thing I just never understood or agreed with. I don't feel there is really any role that HAS to be filled by the party. Even in AD&D, we played different games with all wizards, all thieves, and all fighters. With easy/fast healing in 5E, this is even less of an issue IMO.

Of course! If you don't experience it, then it's not going to be an issue for you. But I would suspect the people who are pushing back against your opinions on the state and the needs of the game are people who had the Cleric Heal-bot issue, which is why your desires for the 5E game would be unwanted by them.

Just because we don't experience an issue doesn't mean there isn't one. And thus any claims we might make to say that possible "corrections" to these unperceived issues are unnecessary or outright bad are of course going to be met with resistance.

 

[DND_Reborn]

Of course! If you don't experience it, then it's not going to be an issue for you.

I didn't mean I didn't experience it, more so that I meant if the party doesn't have a cleric, they need to change their tactics, etc. to play to their strengths and make up for their weaknesses. Sorry if that came across otherwise.

Even with what I am doing, reducing sameyness, there is still enough overlap that most parties can use subclasses to fill any gaps they perceive.