D&D (2024) D&D 5.11 - the time of big change is over

[Remathilis]

They really didn't, though? Particularly based on what Crawford was saying in the videos attached, and in the survey response videos. This was what theybpromised all along.

To be perfectly honest? I think WotC is opting now to play it safer than they originally wanted to.

The D&D community has complained about several large bugbears in the 5e rules: short rest recharges being unreliable due DM fiat. Dual wielding costs a bonus action. Wild Shape being a shopping spree in the MM and any other book with monsters in it, Warlock magic being utterly incompatible with every other type of spellcasting in the game. Exhaustion being far too punishing. WotC put out a bunch of UAs that said, "we hear you" and then said "nevermind, we're keeping them as is, with MAYBE a few bits of errata". Even things that didn't score badly got tossed to the dumpster: unified subclass progression, prof bonus/day instead of SR or ability mod/day., epic boons at 20th level. The only major changes we're getting that literally weren't telegraphed in 2022 are weapon mastery and unified spell lists. Everything else is language clarification and adding/replacing class features.

WotC walked into the living room, decided that ugly half-wall between it and the kitchen needed to go, took all the furniture out of the room, and then, they just decided to paint the wall and put everything back. If they hadn't made a show about removing the half-wall in the first place, most people wouldn't have thought it was an option. Now I'm not overly mad: I like the changes they are making. But the fact they are backpedaling on so many design ideas at this point in design doesn't tell me this was based on player feedback as much as a desire to make sure this new PHB doesn't split the fanbase.

Anyway: this should be the death knell that this is anything resembling 5.5 or 6e: This is Tasha's 2.0.

 

[Henadic Theologian]

Ironically packet 6 had some HUGE changes.

 

[TwoSix]

Ironically packet 6 had some HUGE changes.

"HUGE" is definitely overstating it. Making a bard a noncaster would be huge. Making a cleric use pact magic casting would be huge. Giving rogues and monks weapon maneuvers would be huge.

The current packet? Not huge.

 

[Parmandur]

To be perfectly honest? I think WotC is opting now to play it safer than they originally wanted to.

Buy what they are doing now us what they said they would the entire tine...? From the start Crawford said that most of what they put out early in was probsvly not going to make it, bit they couldn't know what would stick until they threw it against the wall. This is how the WotC design team always forecast the process looking like, including that the final result would look a lot like 2014.

What we are seeing here isn't a vhange in ditection, but the first serious proposal for final publication. The other tests were explicitly to push the limits of the system and find out what shape people wanted for the final prodict, this test is for what they think they can put in a book and sell.

A better design metaphore is that tjis playtest process is like a "getting dressed for Prom" montage, with the initial options being outlandish and ridiculous before settling on a final set of clothes to impress.

Anyway: this should be the death knell that this is anything resembling 5.5 or 6e: This is Tasha's 2.0.

Yes, it should have died when Crawford spent the better part of a year saying exactly that, but people didn't let that stop them. And I see people decrying this as 6E still!

 

[Parmandur]

Ironically packet 6 had some HUGE changes.

For real.

"HUGE" is definitely overstating it. Making a bard a noncaster would be huge. Making a cleric use pact magic casting would be huge. Giving rogues and monks weapon maneuvers would be huge.

The current packet? Not huge.

"Hige" within the confines of the established game, certainly. It's not as out there as the experimental tests, but this still represents a lot of evolutions from the '14 rules, but in earnest for publication.

 

[TwoSix]

For real.

"Hige" within the confines of the established game, certainly. It's not as out there as the experimental tests, but this still represents a lot of evolutions from the '14 rules, but in earnest for publication.

Different strokes, I guess. Outside of bard spell list access and rogue cunning strike, it mostly feels like a paint job, not any kind of reconstruction.

 

[Parmandur]

Different strokes, I guess. Outside of bard spell list access and rogue cunning strike, it mostly feels like a paint job, not any kind of reconstruction.

I mean, sure. But all these Classes other than Ranger were already quite popular. These are much bigger changes than WotC has been willing to let in Errata, so relatively these are huge.

 

[TerraDave]

I sympathized with this thread title, and made a joking post about it in another one. But no matter how sad Crawford may have seemed in that one video, he was sitting on some BIG stuff.

Bards picking their spell list are cunning strike were very big, and many other changes were not small. I bet more big changes are to come.

 

[TerraDave]

On the other other hand, they have dropped class groups, wildshape templates, paladin and ranger cantrips, ranged paladins,and more. This revision remains a moving target.

 

[Yaarel]

On the other other hand, they have dropped class groups, wildshape templates, paladin and ranger cantrips, ranged paladins,and more. This revision remains a moving target.

They dropped class groups? Ranger and Paladin cantrips? LOL, so many memos that I missed.