D&D General Requesting Advice on FR Pantheon

[Theory of Games]

You're thinking of the Greyhawk setting. The Faerunian god of the sun is Amaunator.

The link is literally from the FR site. Sometimes the supernatural beings "travel", like how Asmodeus is in Greyhawk, the Realms and Golarion.

 

[dave2008]

I am starting an FR game (2014 5e) soon, and I would like to give the Piety subsystem from Mythic Odysseys of Theros a try. For those unaware, Theros offers players a detailed breakdown of 15 gods, with associated benefits depending on how much the player furthers their patron god’s agenda. My intention is to do the same for the FR pantheon, in a campaign that makes heavy use of all matters divine.

My players are enthusiastic about a divine-driven campaign, but are mostly unfamiliar with FR lore. I would like them to come in with a passing idea of who the main players in the pantheon are. Therefore, I will prepare a handout that somewhat mimics the player-facing section on the gods in Mythic Odysseys of Theros. The idea is that each player will pick a god as a patron, and that will shape the campaign ahead. As I create this handout, I would kindly request some advice from other DMs and players on two topics:

Roster

FR has dozens upon dozens of gods. I would like to present a number that can be reasonably read or skimmed by players interested (20 at maximum). The rest will be available should players like them, they just won't be explicitly detailed. In this list of "Core" gods, I would like to (a) include the best-known deities of the setting, (b) cover a good range of portfolios, and (c) include the “main” deities of each playable race in the 2014 PHB.

I'm thinking that the best way to deal with racial deities is probably to lean onto 4e’s idea that some gods in the Faerûnian pantheon go by a different name for other races. 4e explicitly called out that Chauntea is Yondalla, Selûne is Sehanine, Talos is Gruumsh, etc. Corellon and Lathander could also probably be one and the same.

My questions to anyone who has played or DM-ed in FR are: have you ever prepared/received a similar “core” roster of the deities? If so, which gods made it? Did it include evil gods? Are there any portfolios/domains that you felt were missing that I should make sure to include? What gods are so intrinsic to either your D&D experience or your love for the FR setting that they should be included no matter what? Any and all advice is welcome.

Presentation

The player-facing section on gods from Theros includes all sorts of bits for each god: a description, presentation, influence, goals, divine allies and enemies, as well as typical worshippers. It adds suggested classes, races, backgrounds, a random table for that god’s ideals reflected by the PC, and a random table of how that god called the PC.

To anyone who has either issued handouts on gods or received them, is there anything that is missing, or that is perhaps overkill? If you were a player, what do you like to see, when you are reading through a pantheon to select a deity that will have considerable impact on the game? Are things like holidays, texts and rites (found in other 5e products describing religions) useful to create an evocative idea, or just too much? Experiences from those who have played any game heavily featuring gods (e.g. Pathfinder) are also very welcome.

I whole heartedly agree with giving the piety system a try. I am not very familiar with the FR pantheon, but here is the piety systems I developed for my Tiamat project. I did it a little different from the ones on Theros and gave Champions of Tiamat different paths to her boons. Anyway, here is my draft:

 

[cbwjm]

The link is literally from the FR site. Sometimes the supernatural beings "travel", like how Asmodeus is in Greyhawk, the Realms and Golarion.

That's a fandom site, not an official FR site. the link even places him in Oerth not the forgotten realms. He's never been a part of the FR.

 

[plecostomus]

If your players have also played BG3 they might enjoy references to the prominent gods in the game. Alternately, if you want to make the gods your own and you don't want preconceptions, maybe these are some to avoid:

1. Dead Three (Bane/Baal/Myrkul) - the villains
2. Mystra - featured in Gale's sidequest, physically appears in-game
3. Shar / Selune - featured in Shadowheart's sidequest, Shar physically appears in-game, Selune has a daughter who appears in-game
4. Ilmater - has a sidequest and temple
5. Umberlee - has a sidequest and temple
6. Lathander - has a sidequest and dungeon (set in a temple)
7. Loviatar - has a devotee who um, explains Loviatar's role
8. Kelemvor - has a devotee who explains Kelemvor's role and guards a graveyard
9. Jergal - plays a prominent role in the game, but in his case it makes more of an argument for not including him since his character is very defined

Lolth and Gond have some factions associated with them. Maglubiyet has a single angry worshipper. Other gods get mentioned in text or by NPC dialogues. You can also look at the BG3 deities list to see which ones are selectable by player clerics if you're curious how they handled it. Notable on this list is Vlaakith, who is not actually a god.

The 3P supplement Dragonlance Companion has a similar piety system to what you've described, with divine items players can "power up" by gaining piety, and a list of actions which gain/lose piety for each god. Most Dragonlance gods can be easily exported to one FR god or another.

 

[James Gasik]

You're thinking of the Greyhawk setting. The Faerunian god of the sun is Amaunator.

Lathander, I say!

 

[aco175]

That's a fandom site, not an official FR site. the link even places him in Oerth not the forgotten realms. He's never been a part of the FR.

Asmodeus is in Sword Coast Adventurer's Guide (SCAG) P21.

I never heard of him there until 5e and have not used him yet. There are so many other gods to use. I think I tend to use only 8-10 of the gods.

 

[Amphytrion]

Sincere thanks to all and everyone who responded, it's deeply appreciated.

I've started from the roster that @GreatestHonor kindly provided and worked from there. I agree with @Derthwen's suggestion to include Bahamut and Tiamat, as they (a) are iconic, at this point, (b) are the dragonborn's natural choices, and (c) do a lot of heavy lifting, since Bahamut covers all Lawful Good concepts all on his own.

As for Garl Glittergold, I think I'll keep him, both because he is whimsical deity of humor, but also because he covers a lot of ground as well with his portfolios of luck, gems, and trickery. This doesn't mean I'm writing out Gond entirely, but I think Garl is a mainstay. Maybe in this version of FR, Tymora and Beshaba (or Tyche, their predecessor) are the famed daughters that fled the Golden Hills.

Try to have one for each alignment with enough bad guys to have their own conflict, and maybe a few good conflicts as well.

This is good advice and important to keep in mind for this, as the divine relationships can play a role in the piety system and are also fun to play with.

You could also roll Gruumsh into an aspect of Talos.

I like this, and intend to make use of all these 4e aspects (X god is also Y racial god), for a few reasons: (1) I want to keep the number of "main" gods manageable, (2) I want to avoid gods that are too similar, and (3) it increases the number of divine relationships, which ties thing together. Gruumsh has something with Corellon and Maglubiyet and not much else going on, but if Gruumsh is also Talos, I can use relationships from both aspects.

To my knowledge, 4e's explicit aspects were: Chauntea = Yondalla, Selûne = Sehanine Moonbow, Sune = Hanali Celanil, Talos = Gruumsh. I don't mean to go crazy with it, but I think I can stretch that so that the exuberant elven god of the sun is also the main exuberant god of the dawn (Lathander = Corellon) and that the oppressive goblinoid god of tyranny is also the main god of tyranny (Maglubiyet = Bane).

I whole heartedly agree with giving the piety system a try. I am not very familiar with the FR pantheon, but here is the piety systems I developed for my Tiamat project. I did it a little different from the ones on Theros and gave Champions of Tiamat different paths to her boons. Anyway, here is my draft:

This looks amazing, many thanks for posting! It's an excellent take on diversifying the boons as well, and I may model my Tiamat's page on this one. If you don't mind me asking, what is this Tiamat project of yours?

@plecostomus, my players are not BG3 players but I very much appreciate your list and link, it gives some context to what deities they thought useful to include. I also appreciate the shoutout to the Dragonlance Companion, which I happen to own (in POD, no less!), but had completely forgotten about. I will certainly make use of Paladine and Takhisis's write-ups there and maybe some others as well.

I'll write up a preliminary list now and post here soon on a separate comment.

 

[Amphytrion]

Asmodeus is in Sword Coast Adventurer's Guide (SCAG) P21.

View attachment 412411

I never heard of him there until 5e and have not used him yet. There are so many other gods to use. I think I tend to use only 8-10 of the gods.

In-universe, he rose to godhood when he devoured Azuth in 4e. Azuth got better eventually somehow.

Out-of-universe, 4e (maybe later 3.5?) rose devils to greater prominence and Asmodeus got a promotion to godhood across multiple settings as a result.

 

[James Gasik]

I mean, the difference between an Arch-Devil and a God is really poorly defined anyways, as Arch-Devil's can grant Cleric spells to their followers if they want to.

 

[Amphytrion]

Here is my current list:

BAHAMUT, god of justice, wisdom, peace, rulership, selflessness, and redemption.
TIAMAT, goddess of pride, power, wealth, greed, avarice, arrogance and might.

CHAUNTEA, goddess of home, hearth, agriculture, familial love and simple joys. Known to the halflings as Yondalla.
LATHANDER, god of the dawn, spring, beginnings, renewal, exuberance, youth, athletics, and arts. Known to the elves as Corellon Larethian.
SELÛNE, goddess of the moon, autumn, starlight, travelers, wanderers, dreams and divination. Known to the elves as Sehanine Moonbow.
MYSTRA, goddess of magic, spellcasting, and the Weave.
KELEMVOR, god of the dead, judgment of souls, natural ends, and closing of cycles.
OGHMA, god of knowledge, logic, thought, ideas, reasoning and learning.
SILVANUS, god of nature, fauna, flora, and harmony with the wilds.
TEMPUS, god of war, warriors, battle, and battlefields.
BANE, god of tyranny, strife, conquest, and order through oppression. Known to the goblinoids as Maglubiyet.
TALOS, god of destruction, savagery, storms, and natural disasters. Known to the orcs as Gruumsh.
SHAR, goddess of darkness, loss, forgetfulness, and oblivion.

MORADIN, god of the forge, craftsmanship, vocation, clan values and dwarven tradition.
GARL GLITTERGOLD, god of humor, trickery, pranks, wit, gems, and cooperation.
ASMODEUS, god of indulgence, temptation, contracts and deception.

So that's 16 so far, and I do have some space. Is there anyone glaringly missing? You've all kindly suggested a few others, so here's who I'm considering thus far:

• Tyr, Torm & Ilmater: a fixed trio. It seems to me that their portfolios are variants of Bahamut's, and that while it is nice to have all 3, having all 3 + Bahamut may be overkill for a limited list.
• Sune: I admit I think of Sune as the third wheel on the Lathander-Selûne dynamic, as in they already cover much of her portfolio. I really do like the very militant and overzealous characterization her faith was given in its write-up in Minsc & Boo's Journal of Villainy. I'll include her if I have space.
• Tymora: If I include her, I feel like I have to include Beshaba, and Garl already covers luck. I do understand that she is also patron of adventurers, which may push her over the edge.
• Gond: I love Gond, and I'm tempted to include him, but he is just one of 3 Oghmyte divine servants, and there's some overlap with Garl.
• Lolth: I likewise am very fond of Lolth, but I think of Lolth as a slippery slope. She is a racial deity of a subrace, and the elves are full of those (Rillifane, Deep Sashelas). Even if I restrict myself to evil subracial deities, I'm still left with the impression that any list that includes Lolth should also probably include Laduguer.
• Auril, Umberlee & Malar: They are very fun deities, especially Umberlee. I think of them all at roughly the same level, and I think the first two explicitly work under Talos (the latter works under Silvanus with Mielikki, maybe?).
• Bhaal & Myrkul: Very iconic, full of fun history, and a trio with Bane. It's hard not to deal with them. But they are both at the edges of the divine ladder, and from a player perspective, would anyone pick the god of murder?
• Cyric: I also really like Cyric, and he does have a rich history with Mystra and Kelemvor. But Cyric's portfolio has been hollowed out by the return of the Dead Three and Asmodeus's ascension, so I'm not sure what to do with him.

The line-up is indeed missing a CE god of evil madness. In older editions, this would have been Moander, but Tharizdûn has fully eclipsed him since 4e (when he made the FR Greater Deities list under the alias Ghaunadaur), so maybe Tharizdûn should make it. The issue with CE gods of madness is that their list of divine relationships is usually all enemies, and players tend to understandably avoid them.

Anyhow, happy to hear any and all feedback on who to include and whether there is a portfolio glaringly missing.

I would also be very thankful for advice on the presentation of the handout itself (what information to include, what not to include). If you've ever prepared a deity handout for a similar game, I'd love to hear how you structured it.