2 Epic questions

[Particle_Man]

I just got the Epic Level Handbook yesterday and may be missing something. I hope that wiser minds than mine can help here.

1) p.6 says that one's base attack bonus does not increase after 20th (character) level. The fastest BAB progression I know is +1/level, as done by the fighter and her cousins. Yet for certain epic prestige classes (like the divine emissary, p.27) one of the prerequisites is a base attack bonus of +23. Am I missing something obvious here, or is this a typo that should read "Combined Base Attack Bonus and Epic Attack Bonus: +23" (Similar for other epic prestige classes with a prerequisite of a BAB of over +20).

2) The Listen and Spot skills have a DC 80 to automatically defeat illusions with auditory and visual aspects, respectively, without even needing to make a will save. Is the Epic Illusionist simply screwed, or is there some way to counter this auto-detect? This one seems like a problem, since spot and listen are two of the most popular skills to max out in (admittedly less than epic) campaigns I have played in. I was thinking of maybe changing the rule to some sort of opposed epic skill check of spot(listen) vs. disguise or something, but if there is something that I have missed, I could go for that.

 

[kreynolds]

1) p.6 says that one's base attack bonus does not increase after 20th (character) level. The fastest BAB progression I know is +1/level, as done by the fighter and her cousins. Yet for certain epic prestige classes (like the divine emissary, p.27) one of the prerequisites is a base attack bonus of +23. Am I missing something obvious here, or is this a typo that should read "Combined Base Attack Bonus and Epic Attack Bonus: +23" (Similar for other epic prestige classes with a prerequisite of a BAB of over +20).

At 21st level and above, your base attack bonus never goes up. However, every other level, you receive an Epic Attack Bonus. This bonus is counted as part of your BAB in regards to feat and PrC requirements.

 

[Spove]

IIRC for epic levels BAB increases by 1 every odd level.

Saves increase by 1 every even level.

(I may have odd/even backwards, don't have the book in front of me.)

Edit: Ok so it's not called BAB, but you get the idea.

 

[kreynolds]

Edit: Ok so it's not called BAB, but you get the idea.

That's just the thing though. Many people don't get the idea. There's a lot of confusion out there about BAB in the epic level rules.

 

[Tyrrell]

2) The Listen and Spot skills have a DC 80 to automatically defeat illusions with auditory and visual aspects, respectively, without even needing to make a will save. Is the Epic Illusionist simply screwed, or is there some way to counter this auto-detect? This one seems like a problem, since spot and listen are two of the most popular skills to max out in (admittedly less than epic) campaigns I have played in. I was thinking of maybe changing the rule to some sort of opposed epic skill check of spot(listen) vs. disguise or something, but if there is something that I have missed, I could go for that.

A fortieth level character with maxed out ranks in spot, a +8 wisdom stat bonus, and epic skill focus spot still needs to roll a 19 in order to reach DC 80.

Certainly you could take epic skill focus more than once and wear an epic version of eyes of the eagle if you wished. In general I think that this is sufficiently rare to be of little worry to characters who are npc's of less that 40th level. Of course if for some reason you want to crank up the levels really really high yes the illusionists are screwed

 

[Hammerhead]

+30 skill items are very cheap. I'd imagine that they'd be very popular at epic levels.

 

[Crothian]

+30 skill items are very cheap. I'd imagine that they'd be very popular at epic levels.

I agree. 18,000 for +30 to one or two skills that you use all the time is an easy desicion. My ranger would love to get +30 to his wildnerness lore rolls since I'm always tracking people.

 

[kreynolds]

I agree. 18,000 for +30 to one or two skills that you use all the time is an easy desicion. My ranger would love to get +30 to his wildnerness lore rolls since I'm always tracking people.

+30 to Wilderness Lore = 18,000gp
+31 to Wilderness Lore = 192,200gp

That still makes me laugh my a$$ off.

 

[Crothian]

+30 to Wilderness Lore = 18,000gp
+31 to Wilderness Lore = 192,200gp

That still makes me laugh my a$$ off.

Not that I don't trust you, but where is that said in the book? I've seen the increase in price for everything magical except skill bonuses. So, obviously, I'm just missing it.

And it is very funny.

 

[kreynolds]

Not that I don't trust you, but where is that said in the book?

Page 123. It's a list of everything that defines an epic level item.

And it is very funny.

Isn't it though.