[3.5] Damage Reduction & Andy Collins

[Tsyr]

So, wait, what is the status of "holy" damage reduction? I was looking forward to that...

Though I must say I am happy about hearing the presense of Cold Iron. I've been using that in my games for a long time (Well, not as DR, Fey just take extra damage from Cold Iron weapons).

 

[BryonD]

I think the assumption is that the weapon is plated with silver, not made of pure silver. Pure silver'd probably work, too, but I'd imagine that it wouldn't be all that durable. Of course, I could be (and likely am) wrong about the durability of pure silver weapons and the rest of this, for that matter....

Best,
tKL

They used the term "alchemical silver" in places. It seems to mean that a process has been used to blend the silver into the weapon.

But it is really just flavor.
Nothing would change if you described it as plating except you would just need to ignore issues of wear.
Nothing would change if you described it as "pure" except you would have to ignore issues of durability. (and perhaps the value of the silver used would not match the official cost)

But nothing in the mechanics hinges on on which model you like.

 

[MerricB]

So, wait, what is the status of "holy" damage reduction? I was looking forward to that...

Don't expect "holy" damage reduction, would be my guess.

You have "lawful", "good", "chaotic" and "good" as the aligned types.

You have "magic" and "epic" as the magical types.

You have "silver", "adamantine" and "cold iron" as the material types.

And then there's "blunt" and similar weapon restrictions.

Cheers!

 

[Petrosian]

Do we need a glof bag of weapons?

The article in dragon 306 stated there would be three materials types.

it also extolled how they were expecting, or was it hoping, for 3rd party publishers and Gms for local games to start adding new ones within a few days or a week of the release.

In the same article they specifically mentioned the money your character saves from not buying high plus weapons to be apsnet on alternate materials weapons.

They also mention the excitement about using these in combinations creating a whole lot more combinations for specific needs.

I think it boils down to we have a comment from Ac that seems to run against the tone of the official article which devoted the majority of its time on the subject. it seems clear he disagrees with it, but the system still seems to support the article claims.

So, whether you will NEED a golf bag of weapons depends on two things... the GMs willingness to use DR and its "possibilities" as a threat issue (whether from using published products, 3rd party or just making it up)... the player/character's willing ness to just suffer the -10 damage per hit and bull through it.

IMO, in a world where the Gm makes it rare, it will be probably not worthwhile. It sounds like that will mean not using a significant number of their varmints as written. IMO in a world where the Gm makes it routine, its well worth it to look for ways around it and thus the golfbag seems apropos and "logical" from the character's perspective. (Did you ever consider it nonsensical when lower level player characters went for blunt weapons when going up against skeletons? -10 per hit is as much or more of a hit than that was. Remember -10 will be the baseline DR, with 5's and 15's still being around in sufficient numbers.)

I do not see in the mechanics anything that contradicts the articles position. ACs opinion is intriguing but so far, the rules do not support his position and its differences with 306.

i would gleefully like to see the rules in the new PHb agree more with his position than the article's, i just am not expecting that.

What type of rule would i see as supporting that and moving away from the Gb plan? A materials spell below PAO that allowed you to meet materials dr spells similar to the ones which let you meet magic or the proposed ones that allow you to meet alignment.

 

[buzzard]

I think the assumption is that the weapon is plated with silver, not made of pure silver. Pure silver'd probably work, too, but I'd imagine that it wouldn't be all that durable. Of course, I could be (and likely am) wrong about the durability of pure silver weapons and the rest of this, for that matter....

Best,
tKL

Pure silver is too malleable to make a good weapon. Even silver alloys are too weak. Plating is the only reasonable option.

buzzard
[your friendly neighborhood metallurgist]

 

[jasper]

buzzard please don't inject real facts into rules.
in the old days my silver weapons were solid silver. I didn't even think of dipping or electro plating the material.

 

[Psion]

MerricB wrote:You have "lawful", "good", "chaotic" and "good" as the aligned types.

The term for "good" weapon enhantments is "holy".

Petrosian wrote: it also extolled how they were expecting, or was it hoping, for 3rd party publishers and Gms for local games to start adding new ones within a few days or a week of the release.

Well, I find the golfbag argument convincing in general, but I am not especially concerned about what third party publishers and individual DMs do. That's entirely their bag.

(Ouch. Pun was not intended...)

Fenes 2 wroteDR tops out around 15

I don't consider that insignificant. That is enough to frustrate the attempts of most reasonable PC groups.

Worse yet, it will make power attack in general and (given the changes to power attack) two-handed power attack in particular that much more compulsory for fighters, which in turn will dull variety.

 

[Technik4]

Just wondering aloud...

So while mithril will still be applicable to weapons (as far as we know), it will not be a special material to break DR.

As far as a mostly lawful party fighting a creature with 10/Chaos DR, it will probably be a harder fight than its CR indicates. Hopefully the MM will address this with raising its CR or adding bonus experience to a group who defeats it. Of course, it will also be difficult for a typical Good-aligned party (far more common imo) to fight something with 10/Evil. Of course, if you are fighting something that matches your alignment, a lot of possibilities open up for parley and other non-violent tactics; maybe this new DR will make the game less Computer-RPGish?

I hope to see a lot of DR 5/x, a near equal amount of DR 10/x, and only a few DR 15/x.

I hope 3rd party products take Andy's words to heart; I already buy very few 3rd party products, splitting from the way wotc is doing things (with a rather limited set of things that penetrate DR) will only make me less inclined to buy them.

Technik

 

[buzzard]

buzzard please don't inject real facts into rules.
in the old days my silver weapons were solid silver. I didn't even think of dipping or electro plating the material.

Gol darn it, what was I thinking.

I think my fighters will be swtiching to linguini weapons.

buzzard

 

[Goobermunch]

IIRC, align weapon will be a second level spell. It means that a party can align their weapons as needed. I can't recall if there's a cross alignment prohibition, but I can't imagine that there would be.


--G